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Creature — Frog
When Noxious Toad is put into a graveyard from play, each opponent discards a card.
Noxious Toad Discussion
2 months ago
Strangelove Thanks for your suggestions! I always wanted to add Noxious Toad and Abyssal Gatekeeper but i can't seem to get my hands on them lol. I'm going to test some more group discards as suggested and try to find someplace for Carrion Feeder , if you think there's something i should cut that would also be very helpful, this is a pet deck of mine, I've got more competitive ones but I'm constantly trying to tune this one and always get exited every new set for some janky creature to add, but it gets harder and harder to make cuts to add something new.
2 months ago
Contamination does not spark joy :)
I'm not sure how spikey you want to be, but...
I found that once your table understands how dependent you are on Shirei, they kill it; and then you don't do much. I felt like the only playable version was with lots of discard: consistently trading 1:3.
Death triggers like Abyssal Gatekeeper are priority picks because they allow you to respond to your opponents' plays at flash speed instead of at end step.
Noxious Toad is the best version of this because it quickly locks your opponents out of the game by forcing them to play at flash speed or else discard as soon as they draw. (note: oracle says "each opponent")
4 months ago
Chainer's game plan should be something like... Ramp > Control > Reanimate.
Focus on filling and stealing from your opponents' graveyards and protecting Chainer.
Stax: Honestly, I would avoid hard stax. It encourages your opponents to hate you and escalate their power-level.
What this deck really needs is ramp: 38-40 lands and 12-16 cards like Bubbling Muck , Charcoal Diamond , Heartless Summoning , Burnished Hart , Coalition Relic , Revel in Riches , Black Market , Magus of the Coffers , Gauntlet of Power , Nirkana Revenant , etc. Also Phyrexian Tower .
...If you want to lean into stax... here's a list for evil people :)
4 months ago
I know that technically speaking, the ordering of a graveyard is a rule. Cards go into the graveyard in the manner in which they are sent there. For example, if you cast Bone Splinters , sacrifice a Noxious Toad to fulfill the card's cost, then while it is on the stack you cast a Fatal Push for the Revolt trigger, your graveyard will be ordered as such:
(Cards listed from how they would enter, not how it would physically look)
I also know that mass wipes hit all affected permanents at once and so their ordering is basically however you see fit.
To the question:
Up until today, I didn't know of any single card that actually cared SPECIFICALLY about the card ordering. Then I saw Death Spark .
Are there other cards like this that want specific ordering? Or cards that want certain cards after a certain number from the top?
See, like when I play Charmbreaker Devils , I'd just filter out the Instant and Sorcery cards, shuffle them, present to an opponent face down and they draw one out at random for me. Then they all go back on top of my graveyard in a big pile.
Now I see that is actually wrong. So now I am curious as to the extent of my potential mistakes.
9 months ago
No, they're not. Alesha's effect still sucks. Also, you're just flat-out wrong if you think using Fume Spitter every turn until there aren't any creatures on the board except your own isn't worthwhile. Same goes for Heap Doll , same goes for Harvester of Souls , same goes for Workhorse if you have something like Winding Canyons , same goes for literally 20 other creatures in the deck, like Noxious Toad (oracle text, it's each opponent).
Okay, lockdown isn't viable. Sure. That's why Alesha having to access to white for stax effects is so relevant, right? Mono-black has stax effects aplenty, and especially with Shirei--I can abuse Smokestack and Contamination to literally shut down everything.
It's entirely possible to keep anyone other than yourself from drawing anything but lands with Thoughtpicker Witch , and they'll be topdecking, at that.
You guys act like you know what you're talking about when you haven't even heard of most of these cards before, let alone played them/played against them.
2 years ago
I absolutely love the deck. After seeing this I am now determined to make my own variation including some of the following suggestions. Btw this is so long because its also a note to myself.
The Inkmoth Nexus and Blinkmoth Nexus won't come back because Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker says to return the creature card; they are land cards regardless of what they were on the battlefield. I recommend replacing them with Reliquary Tower and notably Winding Canyons. With all the ways of getting mana on others' turns you can use it quite effectively. Other lands you should consider include: Volrath's Stronghold, Crypt of Agadeem, Westvale Abbey Flip, High Market, Lake of the Dead, Vesuva Maze of Ith and Wasteland (instead of Tectonic Edge.)
Glistening Oil seems a little out of place. Are you using it to make your larger creatures small enough to be returned? If not then you have no reason to play it. If so then you should cut it because there are much better options. You could use Fevered Convulsions to achieve the same thing faster despite the mana investment (and you can use it on enemy creatures.) However, I recommend Sorceress Queen instead, for not only serving the same purpose but also being more versatile and being a creature with power 0 it fits very well.
I don't like Kiku, Night's Flower here because it cant answer anything immediately with summoning sickness and is far less efficient (and fast) than your already insane amount of removal. I recommend replacing it with Zulaport Cutthroat as another Blood Artist. You can also add Falkenrath Noble
At first glance AEther Vial looks really good considering all the 2 and 3 drops. but after thinking about it I realized that there is a far better option you can use: Vedalken Orrery. You may have to spend more mana but you can use it multiple times every every turn rather than once each turn rotation once you get an altar out.
Other cards you could consider are: Marionette Master, Summoner's Egg, Triskelion, Triskelavus, Mesmeric Fiend, Weaponcraft Enthusiast, Noxious Toad, Wild-Field Scarecrow, Dutiful Attendant, Workshop Assistant, Gnawing Zombie, Chimney Imp, Insidious Bookworms, Disciple of Phenax, Fume Spitter, Rotting Rats, Ravenous Rats, Corrupt Court Official, Vampiric Rites, Dark Prophecy, Contamination, Shadows of the Past, Sheoldred, Whispering One, Gate to Phyrexia, Disciple of Griselbrand, Harvester of Souls, Mindlash Sliver, Deathgreeter, Kalastria Healer, Altar of the Brood, Altar of Dementia, Black Market, Disciple of the Vault, Blasting Station, Abyssal Gatekeeper, Bitter Ordeal, Buried Alive, Palace Siege, Soot Imp, Tree of Perdition, Spine of Ish Sah, Trading Post, Solemn Simulacrum, Thrull Surgeon, Slithery Stalker, Ashen-Skin Zubera, Geth's Grimoire, Killing Wave, Necroskitter, Thorn of the Black Rose, Myr Moonvessel, and Arcane Lighthouse (just in case they have a Sigarda, Host of Herons or something.) Also if you can afford it: The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale.
3 years ago
Hey there! Thanks for looking at my deck (Let 'em Die [Primer: Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker])! Here's some general suggestions for you:
Pawn of Ulamog and Sifter of Skulls are amazing token producers. The eldrazi tokens they make can be used for mana ramping, and can sacrifice themselves for death triggers. Neat! I'm testing out the Fabricate abilities of Weaponcraft Enthusiast and Marionette Master as well.
Smothering Abomination, Harvester of Souls, and Grim Haruspex are great for generating card draw for every creature that dies. Vampiric Rites is a 1-drop enchantment (kinda hard to remove) that gives you card draw. Maybe take out the one-time use spells like Read the Bones for these.
I personally like Deathgreeter over Bottle Gnomes, and it has pretty consistently done a higher amount of life gain. Zulaport Cutthroat is a must-have, IMO. It's often my quickest wincon. Gray Merchant of Asphodel and Falkenrath Noble are good for this too, if you have ways to reduce their power to recur them.
You do have a fair number of things with >1 power, or that boost their power. I might recommend Plagued Rusalka, Fume Spitter, and/or Necropede as ways to reduce the power of your bigger creatures, or as a form of removal against your opponents. Maybe instead of Drakestown Forgotten.
You have a lot of discard effects (which is good!), but several of them are sorcery speed (Sadistic Hypnotist, Brain Weevil, Augur of Skulls) or need to be paid for (Drainpipe Vermin). Or that don't recur at all Sadistic Augermage. I might recommend more stuff like Noxious Toad, Mesmeric Fiend, or Disciple of Phenax. That can be used on each opponents turn.
Scarblade Elite doesn't work unless you have another Assassin in graveyard, and only up to 4 times max, and doesn't even recur itself under Shirei. And I like Dutiful Attendant over things like Death Denied or Gravepurge. Maybe look into Living Death as well?
Hope that's not too much info! Welcome to the Perpetual Weenie Murder Club!
3 years ago
Phyrexian Plaguelord is not nearly as recurrable -- but is a great removal engine once you have effectively almost won the game. It also costs 5. It's only really comparable because it self sacrifices (with some effort). Even then, disruption forces you to put your resources into saving the plaguelord, whereas you could be using those sacrificed creatures for other things.
Nezumi Bone-Reader is not comparable -- and I don't run it -- rather, I run creatures that force discard on every turn, but that need to die or enter the battlefield to do so -- Disciple of Phenax, Mesmeric Fiend, Black Cat, Noxious Toad, Corrupt Court Official. This is 2-4 times more triggers compared to sorcery speed. That's not even to mention that you need a ton of Black mana to use Nezumi, which isn't viable at all under resource denial. Run Sadistic Hypnotist before him. It's not nothing, it's an engine piece that is redundant with Viscera Seer, hard to remove, and cheap to play. It's not vital and doesn't need to be -- quintessential INUS condition for establishing an insurmountable board state. The faster you can get rolling, the better (and more redundant pieces = faster).
You could do the same thing on non-active turns with corpse blockade (one of the few free creature sac outlets). The only distinct disadvantage is that is costs 1 more, and the only distinct advantage is that you have a deathtouch blocker on non-active turns. The cost is a big deal for me, since my games are necessarily heavy in resource denial tactics. The blocking is less important for me because I both have plenty of ways to kill creatures and rarely face aggro or voltron strategies that are not well controlled with resource denial. I guess it's a matter of preference here, but for me, it's the active turn that makes the difference. So, you get to sacrifice all your creatures on every turn that is not yours and thus sweep away possible blockers with Attrition, Grave Pact, Big Game Hunter, Bone Shredder, and Abyssal Gatekeeper, amongst other means. Now, at least one of your opponents has an empty board and you have 5 - 10 creatures to sacrifice (or more) -- all of which you can pump into vampire (for real this time) and attack for 10 - 20 damage. This is a clean finisher for grinding games (i.e. my games). In order to blow up the vampire, they would have had to hold onto removal that would otherwise have been directed at some far more threatening card.
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