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Reveal the top ten cards of your library. Starting with the next opponent in turn order, each opponent chooses a different nonland card from among them. Put the chosen cards into your hand and the rest on the bottom of your library in a random order.
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Manifold Insights Discussion
4 weeks ago
Nietzsky thanks for the link!
I see you play more reactive and scepter also requires different cards. I'm playing more cards that prevent scepter and the like, In the Eye of Chaos for example is specifically anti-instant tech and while it is just one card in 99 it definitely has some impact on card choices. One result is playing more proactively and not passing turns and keeping counterspells in case something important is cast. That in turn makes Teferi worse than Narset and the land untapping pretty much irrelevant. Also leads to the disenchant > negate issue...let's say I have the option of casting something or keep the mana open for negate. I would always slam down what I have and play a disenchant on my next turn IF someone has managed to play something like mana rocks or whatever instead of having to decide whether I play or keep a reaction for something that might not come (and lose a turn). Of course, there are spells that can't be dealt with on the following turn, but in the early game it's often rocks that slipped through and that I want to remove again and later my playstyle forces opponents to spend their little resources on not losing to each other's threats when I keep playing aggressively. That works better the more competitive the table is, but to be honest I wouldn't want to run into random suboptimal decks with GAAIV anyway...as I have built it now it's best against opponents that can actually do something an not just want to get value on the table. When playing online against random people I have exchanged Manifold Insights with Supreme Verdict (maybe Wrath of God, not sure if the colour requirement is better than can't be countered) because it happens more often that people just leave a game or their prog crashes and there's also the possibility of running into more creatures than I see locally.
I tried playing Personal Tutor instead of Spellseeker (or Serra Ascendant, I am playing around with changes a bit) and it feels rather good. getting MLD or a wheel is nice. got to check if the cmc restriction is worse than getting only sorceries...
On a side note, I do think that the budget has a lot of impact on how you can play stax. The game warping potential of some high priced cards is so massive that you can build around them in a way that can't be done if you need budget replacements.
4 weeks ago
Nietzsky I had Teferi in the deck until I accidentially sold him. He is ok but it wasn't overwhelming imo. First of all, he starts with 2 loyalty less than Narset and he takes one more +1 to ultimate. Another aspect of Teferi, that I didn't like too much, was that the untapping of lands EOT was pretty much irrelevant and his 2nd ability sets him on 1 if used immediately. Narset on the other hand could potentially use it 3 times in a row before she dies. The rebound would be used on stuff like Transmute Artifact, Timetwister, Manifold Insights, Hurkyl's Recall, Disenchant (if it's in the deck)...but more often than not I'd focus on getting Narset to 9 while drawing a few extra cards. Her costing only 2 mana with GAAIV makes her an easy play between others. I have around 13-15 instants/sorceries that make sense to rebound (obviously not counting MLD and counters).
As for the Disenchant/Counterspell question, I don't play reactively in general with this deck. It's all about slamming down the pieces as early and fast as possible and refilling the hand with strong engines...being able to keep a counter once in a while is fine, but mostly I will be destroying mana sources that have been cast before GAAIV was in play and also remove stuff that has already resolved because I spent my turn for putting more obstacles into play. Especially in the early game I don't want to hold back mana for potentially countering something, but rather play my stuff proactively and destroy what an opponent could still cast in my next turn. This is because the available proactive moves have a high potential of preventing important plays from opponents in the first place.
Spellseeker is better than merchant scroll because it's instant or sorcery and doesn't have to be blue. I don't play Merchant Scroll because there's no blue instant I'd really need that much to include a special tutor for it. As additional tutor I have put in Muddle the Mixture because cmc 2 is a lot more important to find (Cursed Totem, Rest in Piece, Gilded Drake, Sphere of Resistance, Cyclonic Rift...). Spellseeker is a really strong card in general, perfect in my Najeela and Circu deck for example, but there it gets exactly the cards I want to find most of all. Here I'm not sure about it anymore.
Chalice of the Void blocks like a third of everyone's spells so it's pretty strong. I would even say in combination with Lavinia it would shut down even more because she prevents the more expensive spells from being cast, chalice counters cmc 1 (that's what it should do) and without taxes Lavinia counters cmc 0 as well. With taxes in addition the whole board will be a big mess in which people have to think twice about which cards are even castable. I think having Lavinia in the same deck as Chalice is not bad at all...The question is just how many situations are there in which countering cmc 1 spells is bad for me too. It didn't have a negative impact on my plays before, but then I had more combo options that didn't need divining top. I would argue that putting chalice in should go along with using at least staff and probably metalworker as well in my build.
Personal Tutor is interesting and I even have one at home. There are several high impact sorceries, from Timetwister to Armageddon and having another cmc 1 tutor for these can be helpful. Catastrophe is nice because of the flexibility but 2 cmc more than the creature/lands only boardwipes is a bit much. Especially when there are Back to Basics and Winter Orb to fuck with lands as well. There's also Sunder and Mana Breach. I think instead of running more but weaker LD cards I'd rather maximise the chances of finding them when needed. timespiral as a third wheel might be really interesting, also in combination with personal tutor.
Could you link your build to compare?
1 month ago
Your mana curve peaks at 4 mana and you have Mirari's Wake, so it might be interesting to invest in 2-mana land ramp options, so you can cast your 4-drops on turn 3 to get your plan going. I suggest Nature's Lore and Farseek. Gyre Sage grow up and ramp quickly, while Rishkar, Peema Renegade can put the first counter on creatures so you can proliferate them and tap them for mana when needed. I would take out Ikra Shidiqi, the Usurper (you need to hit someone to profit on her - she is better on a lifegain/token deck), Primal Amulet Flip (you don't have many essential sorceries to be copied) and Custodi Soulbinders (a really slow card) for them. // Orzhov Advokist serves double duty: she deters opponents from attacking you if they accept the offer, and also put counters on your creatures for free. Inexorable Tide is free proliferate while you cast your spells. Lim-Dul's Vault is a better tutor than Diabolic Tutor (maybe you should run both). // I would also upgrade the removal package to make it more versatile: Utter End instead of Sylvan Reclamation, Anguished Unmaking instead of Viridian Corrupter (if you want to win with infect, you have to fully commit to it), Abzan Charm (great versatility) instead of Mortify. Swan Song (better because cost less) or Arcane Denial instead of Mystic Confluence (5 mana is a lot to hold in a proactive deck). If you need even more removal, Beast Within and Swords to Plowshares are cheap ones to pick. // In terms of finishers, you could swap out Tuskguard Captain for Herald of Secret Streams. Odric, Lunarch Marshal has great synergy with Atraxa, Praetors' Voice. Champion of Lambholt, Managorger Hydra, Chasm Skulker and Cathars' Crusade require quick answer, or else they win you the game. // In the card advantage department, Bred for the Hunt, Path of Discovery (also create counters), Shapers of Nature (also create counters), Zameck Guildmage and Etched Oracle are repeatable draw while Rishkar's Expertise, Prime Speaker Zegana, Painful Truths and the aforementioned Abzan Charm are 1-shot card draw. I recommend replace Manifold Insights and Mirrorweave with Rishkar's Expertise and Prime Speaker Zegana. It is important to have about 10 ramp sources, 10 draw sources, 5 target removal and at least 3 boardwipes, and you should look for cards that can do more than 1 thing (like Abzan Charm) because they are the most versatile (therefore valuable) cards in your deck. // Guildmages' Forum is a strict upgrade over Opal Palace, because it can put counters on other creatures. I would also reduce the number of tapped lands in the deck, so you can reliably play something on turn 2. Blossoming Sands, Thornwood Falls, Tranquil Cove, Azorius Chancery, Dreadship Reef (doesn't provide colors right away) should be the first ones to be swapped. Some nice cards that enter the battlefield untapped are Caves of Koilos, Llanowar Wastes, Yavimaya Coast, City of Brass, Mana Confluence, Reflecting Pool, Bountiful Promenade, Sea of Clouds, Morphic Pool, Gavony Township, Watery Grave, Hallowed Fountain, Godless Shrine, Breeding Pool (the last 4 are all getting reprinted).
1 month ago
Daedalus19876 I rather have not too many tutors that don't give the cards directly in hand here. With Chains and Uba Mask as key cards of the deck it's sometimes not possible to just get the card from a to-top-tutor in the same turn and then these cards slow you down more than you want. What I have added more of are cards that provide more card advantage, such as Manifold Insights. That's always a gain and at worst you just get mana rocks and cantrips...at best, people give you stuff to hurt each other or they are forced to give you combo pieces.
5 months ago
Ah it's good to see that you have built an Atraxa, Praetors' Voice decklist, and one that is more unique than most (even mine admittedly). I use to include all the praetors in mine for the flavor as well as a bit of infect, but my Atraxa deck paints a big enough target on me at my lgs without those kind of cards as people have seen what it is capable of. I have games turn into essentially archenemy at times. I'm still undecided on the direction of the deck ultimately but it's already my most expensive edh deck. But enough talk of my list, here are some suggestions to consider:
(LANDS) Sea of Clouds in place of an Island, Morphic Pool in place of a Swamp, then cut maybe Manifold Insights for another land like Bountiful Promenade as I think your land count is a bit low. Other changes I would make would be to add an Inkmoth Nexus, and a Reliquary Tower. Inkmoth Nexus has evasion and if your goal is to win with infect you will want as much early game cards as you can to get early poison counters in. I would take out Saltcrusted Steppe for Inkmoth Nexus, and then cut Steady Progress (You already have better ways to proliferate, a number of which are repeatable unlike this one, maybe i'm wrong on this one but I think there's better cards you could have over it here) for Reliquary Tower (while this may not be relevant that often, look at how many cards Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur nets you if he sticks around and you will notice you have no way to have an unlimited hand size). And since you happen to have quite a few sources of proliferate, it might not be a bad idea to put Gavony Township in here to help your creatures out since so many on their own are quite weak.
(CREATURES) I would swap Corpse Cur for Phyrexian Swarmlord, as I don't really see many good targets for infect creatures to bring back outside of course Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon. Viridian Corrupter might be another infect creature you might want to consider using, I have to say spots are looking tight for me to suggest cuts for some cards but I think for this one I would swap Putrefy for this additional infect creature.
Additionally, while I see that you aren't concerned really with +1/+1 counters I still think Champion of Lambholt might be worth consideration for helping to get infect creatures through for even as much as an outright kill. For other aggressive options, you could go the route of Blightsteel Colossus which can simply kill players (It's kind of pricey, but i'm not sure if that's a concern for you). If you were to use this card however, you would want to make sure it's protected from the likes of your Swords to Plowshares etc with Lightning Greaves, Asceticism, Whispersilk Cloak or even additionally with Conqueror's Flail which I talk about more later. Putrefax is kind of similar if even not as strong, and perhaps this kind of strategy can pay off well with the use of equipment and maybe even some pump spells if we were to take inspiration from modern/legacy infect lists?
They rely on taking usually 1-2 infect creatures and pumping them up with cards like Berserk, Become Immense, Vines of Vastwood, Invigorate, Groundswell, Blossoming Defense etc to go for a kill, and while some of these might not seem as effective here in commander, I still think a couple like Berserk and Become Immense are worth using because I already see you have Rancor here and these can help get around the fact that many infect creatures are quite weak on their own. And on that topic of infect creatures being generally frail, a few cards that you could consider using here to solve that would be Teferi's Protection, Spellskite(great for taking removal off your more important creatures), and or Heroic Intervention. A few other cards that modern infect lists make use of from time to time are Distortion Strike, Apostle's Blessing, and then of course the staple Noble Hierarch and Pendelhaven. As I said before the general gameplan with such decks is to attack with generally 1 or so infect creatures and back them up with pump spells like those and more mentioned above, and that's where Noble Hierarch and Pendelhaven (pairs well with Glistener Elf, Blighted Agent, Plague Stinger, Inkmoth Nexus and the like) give the attacker a boost to kill outright in as early as turns 2-4. A few cards that might help with this route would be Duelist's Heritage, the previously mentioned Champion of Lambholt, Spinebiter, Apostle's Blessing (can be used for offense or defense), and Slip Through Space. And I see you have a couple counterspells here, and so maybe this is foolish enough to work, but I think you should consider using Hatred here. It can be put either obviously on an infect creature that is not being blocked/can't be blocked (many good targets would be Blighted Agent, Inkmoth Nexus, Putrefax provided you added it of course) or any other evasive creature or what may not at first be obvious to be used on your commander, because ask yourself how many players early on/mid game are going to stop you from attacking them say maybe 1-2 times with Atraxa, Praetors' Voice who is a 4/4 deathtouch/flying/vigilance creature? What you can do with this is pay all of that life to simply kill someone with Atraxa and then gain all that life back :)
While maybe I fear a bit redundant similarly to Grafted Exoskeleton, Triumph of the Hordes is a card that maybe you have overlooked here. The trample can be very useful for getting damage through and I would probably want to play a card like this over Praetor's Grasp, Wargate, or Viridian Longbow possibly? I have to say that I agree with FiveEightFiveBC's observation about Grafted Exoskeleton, I think if you want to stick with equipment that is yet better, either use Sword of Feast and Famine/Sword of Light and Shadow or something like Conqueror's Flail. I could see stacking a bunch of equipment and using stuff like Hatred, Duelist's Heritage, Become Immense, Glistening Oil, Fireshrieker, Sword of Vengeance, and such just on your commander as a legitimate gameplan also with or without infect.
Lastly, similarly to my earlier suggested Gavony Township, I was curious if your opposed to the inclusion of any planeswalkers here? Because I believe Nissa, Voice of Zendikar could do well here. Others to consider would be Ajani Steadfast, and Venser, the Sojourner. You wouldn't even have to go far with this, as too much and you start to change the theme of the deck, but these few that I highlighted might be of use to you here I thought with or without the likes of Doubling Season, and all the other obvious things that you would use with planeswalkers.
I will try to think of more suggestions, but I think this is enough for now to say the least as I will let you know I spent about 75 minutes in all coming up with all of this so far I think! Let me know what you think of all of this, as I know I suggested a ton of things and not all of which did I havsuggestions on what to replace them with. On a side note, I have to say i'm a bit jealous, do you happen to actually have a specific copy of that judge promo Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite?
6 months ago
I have seen it said before, but I want to question your win-condition as a deck under the "Competitive Hub".
Bruna, Light of Alabaster is a very good "pub-stomp" commander. I am sure you can understand why, it is really good at pumping out damage once you deck has the ramp and enchantments to pull it off. Good card draw or tutoring allows you to pump it up with 2-3 enchantents that get it to one-shot opponents. That wins in three turns!
I think I should break that down just a bit. You need 2-3 cards additional to the commander, and for the sake of arguement, I will say 2. Battle Mastery + Corrupted Conscience for example, given you only have a few other 2 card "combos" with you commander, this one is the cheapest. All together it would cost mana, but your commander really makes that mana and a combat step uninterrupted. Honestly, winning with 2 cards additional to the commander that costs 6 mana outside of green isn't great, but given you can tutor them up well, which you can to some extent as the cards you need are aura enchantments and you are in white.
Truely, this is wrong though. Intuition and Three Dreams are one-card combos with your commander, sadly your commander can't cheat their costs, so if we take Intuition with Bruna, Light of Alabaster, it costs 9 mana, and it one-shots a player per turn.
Per turn is the issue though. A 3 turn win (killing one opponents a turn) leads to 6 turns your opponents have to answer an unprotected body (no hexproof nor any indestructible type effects). 6 turns is forever in cEDH, and since you run so much of your deck as useless enchantments (outside of combat win), it is simply not likely you can counter everything your opponents through at you.
This is why I question your win-condition.
The thing is, a control deck isn't just trying to win. It needs an absurd amount of card draw and cheap answers to stop every attempt at dropping a stax lock or combo finisher. Every Dark Confidant, Trinisphere, and Food Chain needs a Swords to Plowshares, Chain of Vapor, and Swan Song respectively. You don't have the luxury of running just 20 answers for the 20 threats in each opponents deck, you need 60 answers for the 20 threats in each of 3 of your opponents deck. 60 cards that are simply answers won't do the trick either, you are drawing one card a turn, your opponents (collectively) draw 3 a turn. EDH is a game that every player is at a statistical disadvantage.
So run multple answers in each card Grasp of Fate all the Dark Confidant, Trinisphere, and Food Chain all at once. Windfall a new hand of answers, Timetwister back your answers, and draw a new hand. Brainstorm, Ponder, Preordain, Opt, Impulse, Serum Visions and cantrip your way to the right answers for the situation at hand.
You actually have what I would normally say is the next point, prematurely answering threats. Armageddon can wipe a hand out of the game, if your opponents can's cast the cards in their hands, they might as well not have it. Cataclysm is similar, for obvious reasons, and so is Ravages of War, a card I would greatly recommend.
To get more value out of these effects, you need another tutor like Personal Tutor is a great way to find a land-swipe effect, I also suggest better card draw like Timetwister, Time Spiral, Manifold Insights, Treasure Cruise, Dig Through Time, etc.
Cheap answers like Chain of Vapor, Fragmentize, Mental Misstep, Delay, Mindbreak Trap, Rapid Hybridization, Pongify, Into the Roil, Blink of an Eye, Grafdigger's Cage, and other such answers are the best thing to have a ton of. They are blowouts early-game, useful tempo boosts mid-game, and still relevent late game. Being able to have a card for every threat means spending more cards on ramping is unrealistic at best, but running a deck very low to the ground is incredibly useful, pretty much every cEDH control deck is either stax-hybrid control, or straight 1-2 mana answers, some sweepers, and 1-3 mana card draw.
To end all of this, I would recommend greatly changing this deck, or dropping the "Competitive" tag, it is misleading as-is.
I also want you to know, QKNARWHAL, that I mean no disrespect to you or your deck-building capabilities, I do not think that this deck is a bad deck, simply not competitive. A previous user, Podkomorka had showed similar thoughts to mine, yet did not explain them. Podkomorka also was not mentioned or responded to in further posts, which I hope will not be done to myself.
Thanks for reading! - SynergyBuild (I'll toss you an upvote on the way out)
6 months ago
Manifold Insights seems like it would do work in this deck, what do you think of it?
8 months ago
WrinkleBeast16 That's kind of a tough question because there is no great replacement. Many times people will suggest Time Spiral as a replacement, but considering that it's already in my list it's out of the question. Lots of people like to hate on Day's Undoing as a replacement due to its end the turn and exile clauses (which I think is a fair argument), but I don't believe it's as terrible for Azami as it is in other decks. The reason is that Azami loves to dump a lot of rocks early on and doesn't have a way to recover a lot of cards effectively besides casting a wheel or having some form of passive card draw available (Mystic Remora / Rhystic Study). Anyways, I regress, I think Day's Undoing is a fine budget option for Azami, however if you don't want to play it I'd suggest other card draw or tutors Manifold Insights / Reshape etc.