Creature — Insect
When Invasive Species enters the battlefield, return another permanent you control to its owner's hand.
Printings View all
|Magic 2015 (M15)||Common|
Combos Browse all
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Invasive Species Discussion
4 months ago
Also I personally like adding Cartouche of Ambition in my main board to remove creatures and to give your big creatures a lot of lifelink. I found this also really good when paired with cards like Kor Skyfisher and might be good with Invasive Species.
6 months ago
I agree that having a critical mass of high cost creatures can be a fundamental flaw in the Naya design. However I also stated that the line didn't necessarily have to be at power 5. It could be power 4.
Additionally Caretaker also takes CMC into account, so it functions with any creature spell that is CMC 5 or higher. That grants a lot of open space to utilize the mechanic outside the strict nature of Naya's theme.
Recent post: "“Wanted [the soulbond] to be a restrictive pairing” is not what I want at all. I was suggesting that creatures who pair with specific types of creatures is ground worth exploring. I think, in fact, that most of them will just be plain ‘ol Soulbond."
Earlier post: "Soulbond's biggest strike against is it's a complex mechanic. Many players like it, though. and if you can follow what's going on, it has good gameplay. I really don't know if this mechanic will ever return, but its popularity makes me think there's a chance.
So you see where I’m going with this? If X is paired with a creature with power Y or less, ...
Maybe some will be normal Soulbond, some will care about power/toughness, maybe one or two will care about beasts."
You contradict your previous statement. I can understand if you changed your mind but you make an adamant statement that you did not want restrictive pairing for Soulbond at all... whereas you previously stated that you want Soulbond that cares about who they pair with and only some would be normal, now you want the majority to be normal Soulbond.
How do you figure that Caretaker is played into a very different gameplay space than Exploit? Both requires a cost of a permanent on your board. Exploit is flexible in what cost it is, while Caretaker is locked and you have to play it before the benefit happens. Caretaker is definitely the weaker version of an Exploit cost due to those restrictions and setup, but I think it fits given that this kind of cost is not something that is normally within Green, so it does it worse. However because Caretaker is worse I think you can get away with granting higher payoffs.
As for breaking the color pie... No break is happening here to the color pie. Red, Green and White definitely have multiple sources of bouncing own permanents or creatures, so it is not a break of the color pie. You may argue about a break of what is traditionally Naya, but we are trying to make a new mechanic for Naya and after the conflux, Blue and Black mana have entered Naya. I wouldn't say it's a large stretch to have such a mechanic within .
Roaring Primadox , Stampeding Serow and its brother Stampeding Wildebeests , Temur Sabertooth , Ambush Krotiq , Invasive Species are some of them. Not bouncing a creature but bouncing none the less; Quirion Ranger Scryb Ranger I based these on mono green cards, but there's obviously a lot of others with other colors within the Nayan color pairing. Stuff like Fleetfoot Panther or Horned Kavu , Shivan Wurm . Red green had a lot of this stuff in the past. As far as I recall it was not a particularly liked mechanic in my LGS mostly because your opponent could interact with the "cost" and kill your only bounce target, so you had to bounce the creature itself. This was also back when creatures wasn't as pushed as they are now. Also having Caretaker as an optional cost that can't be interacted with and granting a benefit could make Caretaker work where the Red Green bounce for an undercosted big fattie failed.
Again; this is not a color pie break.
While I agree that Soulbond as a gameplay mechanic is more flexible in its core form, as it just requires a Soulbond creature and any other creature, I think Soulbond as a design mechanic is a lot more restrictive than you realize.
As for what decks are fun or not, I'm not going to go into that discussion. I would say most decks that are competitive are pretty linear in my eyes, because that is what makes them consistent and good.
Naya is exactly about the circle of life and normal predation to survive, not for sport like it may seem on Jund. I wouldn't say there's a bond between the gargantuans and their worshippers, as the gargantuans are the prime dangers to the humanoid inhabitants on Naya. The beasts prey on the populace and rampage through the jungle, destroying settlements.
I think for the gargantuans, it's more a tolerance thing. Like when a crocodile rests and opens its mouth to let birds eat out the scraps and clean for them. The crocodile doesn't care for the birds, but there's a symbiotic relationship that benefits both. I wont call it a bond. And certainly not one of the soul. That's why I called it a flavor break.
Thank you for the sauce on the popularity. I recognize that Naya is the least popular of the shards according to WotC's data. However it doesn't say that the mechanic is disliked. Shards of Alara fell into the top of the 25-50 percentile, which WotC classifies as a "liked" position, with the 0-25 percentile to be "disliked". They said some shards (like Esper) broke through the 50 percentile into the "popular" category.
So unless Naya is a vast outlier on the bad end, I don't think it's correct to say that Naya was disliked. Since they positively mentioned Esper to break the category but nothing else, I think it's safer to assume that Naya fell within the 25-50 percentile and is considered "liked, but not popular". You only know that Naya was the least popular of the shards. The rest is speculation.
And this speculation and personal bias is exactly why I kept going with this argument - which I reckoned was lost from the start. From your first post it is pretty clear that you don't consider the ideas applicable, so at first I wanted to know what thought went behind that, also to know what I might not have considered. From thereon it became clearer that some personal bias was present more than thought through criticism. I want people to argue with facts, and not use personal bias and present it as facts.
I don't mind you not liking my suggested mechanic and what it builds on. And if you have some factual or anecdotal evidence that supports a broader consensus which you claim to present, then I'll have to reconsider my position and revalue my viewpoints.
I thank you for our little discussion, but I think it is past time to end this.
1 year ago
I feel ya--it can be easy to go off the rails with deck building. You've got some good stuff to work with here, though, so if you don't mind some less-than-expert ideas, I'll throw a bunch of ideas your way.
I like your big finishers: Phyrexian Processor, Desolation Twin, the wurms (including Sandwurm Convergence), Giant Adephage, Trostani's Summoner. You're packing pretty much all the Populate spells--that's good. Let's protect that stuff with Heroic Intervention, Eerie Interlude, Cloudshift and--if you can justify the price tag--Teferi's Protection.
Hoofprints of the Stag works a little differently from Angelic Accord, but the result is functionally the same. Spawning Grounds is similar to Sandwurm Convergence, but let's you create the token before the end step (but also any end step) which will trigger Accord. Land aura, though, so you have to weigh that. But multiples of your tokens is always better than one, so if doublers are not too hard on your budget, you can't go wrong with those, either.
Eerie Interlude and Cloudshift can also be token doublers by giving you multiple ETBs from each Armada Wurm-style creature. If you go this route, Flickerwisp, Whitemane Lion, Jeskai Barricade, Eldrazi Displacer, Dust Elemental, even Roaring Primadox or Invasive Species will all help you get multiple ETBs. Other creatures that will benefit from this strategy include Hornet Queen, Regal Caracal, and Avenger of Zendikar. I've even used Fiend Hunter to "hide away" one of these (Trostani's Summoner is best) as wrath protection.
Herald of the Host and Nacatl War-Pride are both excellent Populate targets. Timing is everything, so you have to have mana and your Populater ready before the original tokens disappear. Loads of fun when you Second Harvest a board full of NWP tokens. :D
A couple wraths are good to have despite being a creature strategy: Martial Coup has the benefit of wrathing or not and creating some soldiers, while Phyrexian Rebirth gives you a huge threat that's definitely worth populating.
Best of luck!
2 years ago
I tried Cream of the Crop, which is a card I love, but card filtering just isn't as good as gas in this deck, imo, which is why cards I'm normally bearish on like Harmonize have found their way in. I'd probably even run something like Invasive Species over it.
Paradox Engine is great, sticking it to the board is usually a win because it usually gives you functionally-infinite mana while assembling a combo without the drawbacks of Umbral Mantle (and being a bit cheaper to get going).
BTW, if you haven't tried Prowling Serpopard, I really recommend it. It's more tutor-able than some of the other good options, has an efficient CMC-to-power ratio, and it can protect your combo turn on its own. It's a utility card I'm not angry I have to play on T3, which is great.
2 years ago
2 years ago
Rzepkanut Thanks for stopping by!
There are a lot of creatures that do Temur Sabertooth's work, like Roaring Primadox or Invasive Species, but none of them are Elementals, that's why they're out of the map. I want to keep it at tribal. Note that I don't even use the best green card for EDH because of that.
However, Tempt with Vengeance looks amazing! I didn't even know that card existed! I'll definitively try to get one.
Rakka Mar is already part of the deck, love that guy
2 years ago
3 years ago
Would Invasive Species do anything without a Pact out? That's a major concern. In my experience, resolving a Pact so good that trying to get extra value by bouncing is just a win-more.
I'll test the Oaths, thanks for the suggestion! ATM I'm liking the bulk of instants, but replacing Anticipate would be nice.