Council's dilemma - Starting with you, each player votes for time or money. For each time vote, take an extra turn after this one. For each money vote, choose a permanent owned by the voter and gain control of it. Exile Expropriate.
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10 hours ago
Hey, I like your list, it's pretty straightforward -- very much what I am aiming for in a list of my own.
What is your opinion on Expropriate to help close out games? I'm assuming you mostly play multiplayer, and the card is either going to be Blatant Thievery + Time Warp or 4x Time Warps in multiplayer. If Blatant Thievery + Time Warp happens, that is great because you get a chance to attack and untap all your lands. And if you get 4x Time Warp, you can straight up kill the player who is the biggest threat with Dragonlord Ojutai. The main problem with the card is that it is pretty soft to a counter war since it does cost so much mana.
Also, I am intrigued by the lack of a Force of Will. I figured a dedicated control deck would want it as back-up to protect your threats / be able to counter a fast deck's crucial card while still developing your mana.
1 week ago
1-3 hours is pretty long, so maybe winning on turn 7 is already a shortcut, lol. Games here can take long as well, but that usually happens when 2 or more combo/control decks meet and everything is locked down while people try to find a way to sneak in their own game winner without opening a hole for everyone else.
With Jhoira I usually try to make a very offensive start, for example turn 1 a land, Mana Vault and turn 2 another land, Jhoira and with the remaining 2 mana suspending something like Blightsteel Colossus or Ulamog or some other Eldrazi bastard. Opponents have two ways to go then: either they try to kill me before the suspend spell is cast, or they try to prevent the spell from resolving (or let it resolve and answer it immediately). At that point you have to find out what they are planning to do and prepare yourself. You don't really want additional suspend spells then, because Jhoira is either gone again by then or you don't need to throw another fattie into the ring...and you don't want to draw 2 or more mass removals afterwards either.
I've also tried all these time counter Manipulators and found they are not as necessary as they seem to be. Paradox Haze is perfect, sure. Also Fury Charm because it can do other stuff as well if needed and Clockspinning is also fine, also because you can meddle with Planeswalker counters too! The rest looks nice but is probably better replaced with counterspells and other protective cards.
I personally like Expropriate very much because it's one of the cards that can possibly turn around the game in your favour, even if most went bad for you until then. It also depends a lot on timing and on how well your opponents know what their decisions will do for the game state. It's also interesting to know that the decisions have to be made in turn order, starting with the active player. The first one after you will not know how the others decide in the end, even if they discuss the matter. I wouldn't worry too much about it being a boring play, because it will certainly result in political actions. Twincast on your own Expropriate make a lot of fun too, lol
1 week ago
Yes i've played with this deck a lot.
The whole idea with the deck was that it were a really casual deck for a really casual meta at my local game store. BIG spells BIG plays that kinda of thing. The games there take such a long time usually between 1-3 hours. One of the reason i made this deck was to counter that long game time by pretty much winning on turn 7-10.
I don't really like Expropriate because it either becomes me casting 2-4 time warps or blatant thievery + a time warp in one card, which is not really fun for a casual meta where this deck is played most of the time. Not saying using it makes someone a boring person for using it, it's just a matter of personal taste.
The biggest weakness with this deck is that the suspend cards are very easily countered, as you've pointed out with the lack of protections for those spells. Im thinking about reworking this deck soon with some more counters so you're feedback is most appreciated.
1 week ago
The best draw spell for mizzix is Whispers of the Muse. In my UG deck, I do not think I have ever lost a game after casting Expropriate, the card is powerful, and mizzix can cast it for pretty much free.
1 week ago
Have you tested this deck in reality?
I've played Jhoira in my deck Thieves of the Multiverse for a quite a while now and from my experience I can say I'm usually only able to cast her once in the whole game, best on turns 1-3. maybe I cast her twice but then it's often not needed anymore. counting on two card tricks to resolve with suspend is risky, that's why I have removed any huge spell that is not a game winner.
I would absolutely play Expropriate if I were you because this card has won so many games for me. I also don't think you need so many mass removals, as you will probably only cast one and it either turns the game in your favour or you won't get to try a second time. Protecting your suspended spells with counters is surely more important - they win the game for you and blue players will focus on exactly these spells, not on other stuff that might hit the board before. You don't even play a simple Counterspell (and with a higher budget you would have even more and better options) for example. I'd suggest cutting mass removals in favour of more Counters and double checking on the value of your big spells that you want to suspend.
1 week ago
StigIt2me thanks for responding. That's a really good point. Nin is a very 'build around me' type creature. I suppose the only other card I can think of that you might like is Expropriate. That enables you to steal things and take all the turns you could ever need.
1 week ago
2 weeks ago
Expropriate is a great card for this build as well.