|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Commander 2018 (C18)||Rare|
|Explorers of Ixalan (EO2)||None|
|Commander 2014 (C14)||Rare|
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Return six target nonland permanents to their owner's hands.
Aether Gale Discussion
1 month ago
2 months ago
EDIT - added links
Some Maybeboard cards I think should be in the main deck: Benthicore , Inspired Sphinx , Kederekt Leviathan , Pentavus , Intruder Alarm , and Soothsaying . Myr Turbine and Heartstone are kind of meh, I'd replace with Genesis Chamber and Unstable Obelisk . I'd also swap some counterspells - Geist Snatch , Summoner's Bane and Lazotep Plating in for Cancel , Dissipate and Rewind .
Cards I'm not really impressed by: Stormsurge Kraken , Tidespout Tyrant , Windreader Sphinx (depends how much flying you end up with), Sphinx Ambassador , Darksteel Colossus , Pathrazer of Ulamog , It That Betrays . I think it's better to focus on big guys that also have ETB effects than use these.
Some other cards to consider (plus the ones I sent you): Erratic Mutation , Synthetic Destiny , Evacuation , Aether Gale , AEtherize , Crystal Ball , Interpret the Signs , Precognitive Perception , Seer's Lantern , Ugin's Insight , Treasure Map Flip, Zhalfirin Void .
3 months ago
That was a rather rude dismissal of your article, SynergyBuild. Honestly, I'm with Timmy. Anyone who's played with it understands how much better it is than any one of your proposed replacement cards. Seriously, Aether Gale ? You mentioned that there are downsides, but holy cow, it's a sorcery, and if you don't have six things you WANT to bounce, you can't even play it. Maybe some metas would benefit from those cards, but if they can benefit from aether gale, they can sure benefit from cyclonic drift. Rift ends games, and at instant speed, no less. Cyclonic Rift deserves every iota of the hate it gets because it does what it does the best, at instant speed, and with options to cast it for 2 mana or a devastating spell later on.
Also, what was the point of talking about swan song? That's every sorcery or instant, ever. That's not a weakness inherent to rift, speciically. Heck, its being at instant speed means you can just wait until the blue player is tapped out IF there's a blue player at all at the table.
3 months ago
In EDH, when a player with a blue source and at least mana in other sources open on a field. It is a threat. It is a threat not because of a 7 mana spell, but a 2 mana spell, not a spell that deals damage, counters spell, destroys permanents, tutors, or cheats costs, but a bounce spell.
Cyclonic Rift , C-Rift, the big wave, whatever you call it, people know it as one of the strongest, most backbreaking spells in all of EDH, if not the best card in the format.
I am here to say that is isn't.
Part of my series on why other popular staples aren't good ( Phyrexian Arena , Rampant Growth ), or are simply not good in a specific way ( Rhystic Study ), I am not here to deny the power that a card like Cyclonic Rift has, but simply that it isn't a good enough card to warrant the hate or love that it receives.
Before I go over why it isn't good, I need to go over why at nearly every power level, it is good.
In casual EDH, the 50% or less, the Precons, the jank, lies it's the weakest state.
That is where all removal spells, sweepers, or countermagic is the weakest, especially bounce. If no one has threatening boards, why remove them. You'd rather spend 7 mana on a spell to improve yours most of the time, yet those games go long, the Cyclonic Rift acts as a Fog to save you, Sleep to get in for damage, or real removal if you use it on a player's end step if they have to discard just after.
Almost all cards that show heavy play at higher levels show some play at lower ones, and while the price-tag may limit it for most casual players, it does work.
At the 75% or the middle tiers of EDH, where I think EDH players mostly lie, it where it is the most powerful. IF it destroyed any number of target nonland permanents, it would be weaker, because of three reasons:
75% decks often use permanent-based engines to support their gameplan. Think Beast Whisperer along with a deck full of cheap elves, or Paradox Engine in a deck will a lot of Temple Bell effects and mana rocks.
These decks and their creators often expect opponents to remove threats, so have many threats to remove.
They try to protect against sweepers, the only punishing cards for going so wide, with anti-sweepers, think Heroic Intervention , or Boros Charm , and protect against some single-target removal with effects like Darksteel Plate .
Because of this, and because indestructible and hexproof don't protect against a mass bounce effect, along with Cyclonic Rift being the only mass bounce at instant speed that doesn't affect you at all, and doesn't target, it is truly the best anti-75% sweeper by many standards.
In the competitive setting, while not bad, it is mostly relegated to being a 2 mana Chain of Vapor or a Into the Roil that doesn't draw a card, that can let a combo deck get through stax locks once in a blue moon.
Don't get me wrong, being relegated to a slightly worse Chain of Vapor isn't an insult. Chain of Vapor is possible the best removal in cEDH, as decks like Kess consultation or P-Hulk variants Laboratory Maniac wins, and for 1 blue mana, or two in the case of Cyclonic Rift , you get to bounce their wincon as they draw off an empty deck, so they lose...
That is some powerful stuff.
So why isn't it the best EDH card, an efficient spell in nearly any metagame? 2 options for removal, one that crushes many lists and the other a sleek and useful trick?
Because it isn't hyper-efficient, nor is it unbeatable, nor is it irreplaceable.
To start, many cEDH decks that run it run consistent amounts of countermagic to protect it's possible great effect, and numerous cards could fit the spot. It isn't alone. Blink of an Eye , the second Into the Roil has been used over it in many combo lists that more mana-efficient options and many forget the slot all-together, in favor of a cantrip or other removal spell like Abrade or whatever. It isn't very dominant there, and so is easy to explain why it wouldn't be amazing there.
In casual lists, Cyclonic Rift costs about as much as half of many of the casual decks, or even more than some entire casual decks that I have seen. Bringing money-cards wins there, as would a Consecrated Sphinx that costs less money, and I'd wager would have more powerful an effect. Again, an easy argument, but I believe it works.
The really hard place to argue against Cyclonic Rift on the surface is the middle tiers. The 75% lists. Legitimately, I think it is because in the 75% players don't consistently a highly interactive 'metagame'. They just prefer to be interactive 'ingame'.
This comes down to theory, however, when a deck, for example, an elf list abusing the Llanowar Elves style effects along with untap effects to keep making mana, dumping it into something like Ezuri, Renegade Leader . All of that deck and many others get shut down by Null Rod . While that card may be less powerful than other cards against any random deck, as many players know exactly what decks they face, they can play to those decks.
This means general removal, like Anguished Unmaking may be worse if artifacts and walkers don't see much play, you'd rather Mortify . Or if instant speed doesn't help you much, as a lot of City of Solitude / Dosan the Falling Leaf effects exist in your meta, Vindicate , etc.
This is pretty basic knowledge, however, the point here is that there are many, many replacements for Cyclonic Rift in different metagames, and I want to share the ones, only in mono-blue, that in the 75% are why Cyclonic Rift is overrated.
This isn't to say it isn't the best, but that if many, many replacements cost way less $$$ and are occasionally better, that one card shouldn't be considered the best in every situation.
Aether Gale , sorcery, only hits six things, has to hit your things if you don't have enough targets of only your opponents, targets, etc. Yes, there are reasons this is clearly worse.
Why is it better? Politically, you don't have to hit cards from players you team with. Similarly, if you like the Howling Mine on someone's field, don't bounce it. Someone Banishing Light ed someone else's threat you can't deal with? Don't bounce it.
Also, 18 cents. Compared to ~20 dollars and I think it is a steal for budget lists.
Also, it is 2 mana cheaper, despite not being an occasional Disperse .
Evacuation , the downside is simple, it doesn't hit non-creatures, and bounces your own things.
The upsides are for decks that want their own things bounced. ETB effects like Mulldrifter (You can respond to the sacrifice on evoke if you want!), Archaeomancer (infinite sweepers by returning Evacuation , or just recur another card), Duplicant , Solemn Simulacrum , etc.
It is 5 mana too, still an instant, and is only 2-3 dollars right now.
Other options for this could be AEtherize , Whelming Wave , Inundate , Engulf the Shore , Profaner of the Dead , or Scourge of Fleets if you just want mass creature bounce, each with ups and downs, some that only hit opposing creatures, some that are instants, some with graveyard synergies, etc.
For mass nonland bounce that doesn't target? There are tons of options, plenty with lower mana costs than Cyclonic Rift .
Take Coastal Breach . It does a mass bounce for just 4 mana (with 3 opponents), leaving you enough to rebuild first, and being able to be cast much faster, making up slightly for the sorcery speed.
Or Crush of Tentacles , 6 mana? 5 mana and an 8/8, it needs to be in a deck with enough cheap drops to hit surge to be worth it, but an option.
Devastation Tide is a personal favorite, if you run Aminatou, Brainstorm , a lot of scry, Mystical Tutor , Long-Term Plans , Jace, the Mind Sculptor , or are lucky, it is a 2 mana bounce everything. Really strong, however, sorcery (unless you cast it with Miracle on an opponents turn.
Run really high mana cards? Displacement Wave can be better,
Like a big creature attached? Kederekt Leviathan . It even comboes with flicker effects, or can be repeated for 2 mana with an effect like Animate Dead or 3 mana at instant speed whenever with Necromancy in black/blue.
Only need to target one player for political reasons? River's Rebuke .
A lot of one color in the meta? Wash Out
Artifacts/Enchantments? Reduce to Dreams
Even outside of bounce effects, Ixidron can do work xD
Point is, there are options. Even outside of blue, sweepers that can get around the normal protection is seriously strong. Terminus , Hallowed Burial , along with most mass exile effects in white from Play of the Game to Final Judgement / Descend upon the Sinful to the new Urza's Ruinous Blast , etc. Mercilous Eviction in W/B, the -x/-x effects in black like Toxic Deluge or Black Sun's Zenith , etc. in any color, Perilous Vault exists.
These are half of why I think Cyclonic Rift is overrated. Not because it isn't great at what it does, but that it isn't that much better than the rest.
The other half is simple.
Every color (sorry colorless) has answers to Cyclonic Rift off the top of my head.
Black? Many lists abuse cards like Inquisition of Kozilek or other discard to remove powerful cards from opposing decks.
Green? Ugh... Yeah, I guess some colors don't have answers...
(Gutteral Response if they ever make hybrid legal in mono-colored xD)
That's all. Thoughts?
4 months ago
All the cards pskinn01 says are great here are some more
Mission Briefing - basically give you a Scry 2 (in a different form) and flashback for any instant or sorcery
Turn to Frog - Great way to get rid of those annoying 10 power or 12 toughness creatures or those that are indestructible. Plus just being able to things into frogs are fun
The Mirari Conjecture Ik its not an instant or sorcery but it really good two flashback and a copyinstant or sorcery spell as actually won me games
Summary Dismissal - Board wipe for Blue
Mystic Confluence - Great Utility
Sinister Sabotage - Counterspell with Scry 1 (in a different form) sure why not?
Cryptic Command - Again Nice Utility
Frantic Search - A free draw power card
Disallow - An extremely powerful counter spell
Kira, Great Glass-Spinner - Not a instant, sorcery or wizard but free counter once each turn per creature yes please.
Rewind - A free counter spell
Counterspell -Every blue deck has it
Mana Drain -If you have it or can afford/willing to buy cough up the money for it.
Pull from Tomorrow -My favorite draw spell
Omniscience - Play whatever you want for free with no drawbacks other than the big target your painting on your back
Burn from Within - Deals with pesky indestructible
Blastfire Bolt - 5 damage and equipment destruction
Chemister's Trick - Could save your life if backed into a corner or could back your opponent in one.
Countervailing Winds - If you have a lot of cheap cards that makes this card super nice but i would save this card for the opponents big play as the opponent either loses the card or has to waste the rest of their to save it leaving you able to counter attack next if you survive.
Firemind's Foresight - Search spell for instants or sorcery spells
Apex of Power a Free cast cards from exile card
Banefire damage that can't be prevented sure
By Force - a great artifact kill spell
Crack the Earth - well you get hit as well is a quick way to get rid of a pesky card
Rekindled Flame - A burn spell that can potentially come back over ad over again
Reforge the Soul - Need a new hand?
And many more but i don't want this to get to bloated (maybe to late for that.) so i'll end it here. hope these help
5 months ago
Hey, fellow 'Laddie brewer! Stopping by to suggest some ideas to your deck.
It looks like you're mostly trying to go wide with tokens, and occasionally punish with big bois, or all the big bois. I noticed you have several token makers, but not enough big bois to make tokens of, or copy makers themselves. In this scope, allow me to suggest a few cards and possible pieces you could directly replace. These suggestions are rather minor as I don't want to change the scope of the deck entirely, as it should still be yours. :)
- Trading Post in for Whirlermaker : 4 mana and tap to make a dude is too expensive. A better option is to put in good ol' Trading Post as it makes a 0/1 goat for 1 mana and 1 life. Remember that life is a resource too, and at 40 in EDH, 1 life won't make that much of a difference. Besides, Trading Post does it all! Draws a card, recurs artifacts, creates tokens, and gains life. Excellent piece for any artifact deck.
- Cyclonic Rift for Aether Gale : This is the first big money upgrade I'm suggesting. I understand if you want to maintain a budget, but consider splurging on a CyRift if you see the chance to trade for one or come across some extra dineros. It bounces EVERYTHING except for your big bad bois, so you can swing out and win.
- Chaos Warp : Izzet suffers from the ability to remove enchantments or exiling in general (other than very few spells like Lava Coil or Curse of the Swine , two cards you also may want to consider as removal), so having a card that can hit anything is imperative. Chaos Warp at $2ish does just that. At instant speed! Oh, I'm about to get swung at with an unblockable Blightsteel Colossus ? Nope that noise. They've got Propaganda or Sphere of Safety ? Tuck it away! Thus, your chances to win increase even more. Like your number of tokens.
- Twinflame : Cheap copy maker, and you can make even more copies of more things, but only one is enough for Laddie to create an army. It's a bulk-ish card so it shouldn't hurt the budget.
- Desolation Twin : Another bulk card that makes a token on entry?? Excuse me?? Yup. Gives you a free 10/10 token on arrival that Brudiclad would like to use as a template. No annihilator, though, but an army of 10/10s is NOTHING to laugh at.
- Master of Etherium : A cheap, stronger, yet more vulnerable alternative to Darksteel Juggernaut. For three mana, its P/T is also equal to the number of artifacts you control, but it gets better. Other artifacts you control get +1/+1, meaning that EVERY Master of Etherium buffs the rest, giving you effectively twice as much power as the same number of Darksteel Juggernauts. And the cheap mana cost means you can pay to make a token of it on the same turn, then swing out with 10 tokens with 19/19. That's death. lol
- Flameshadow Conjuring : This card's worth a couple of bucks, but it's an enchantment that makes a token of anything you play for red. One mana. That's it. With Etherium Sculptor out, you would pay full price for a big beater AND a token of it that Lad is going to replicate. This card sees plenty of hate, so be way of when you play. Also, the token goes away at end of turn, so make
- Dance of Many : Old, cheap enchantment (costs UU to play) that makes a copy of ANYTHING on the board. Has a UU maintenance cost at the upkeep, but it doesn't matter if you already made other copies and swung with them all.
I invite you to look at (my build)[http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/brudiclad-the-big-bad-boi-builder/] and compare lists for ideas. Again, I didn't suggest many changes because I don't want to take away from the deck; it should still be yours. Lemme know what you think of these changes!
5 months ago
hkhssweiss what cards would you suggest I put in to help tune the deck then? I saw the card Blaze and that works just like a fireball for what I need. So from what I see stuff like Banefire , Comet Storm , Devil's Play and Electrodominance for those big final turn pushes. For defense I was thinking a lot of return spells such as AEtherspouts , Devastation Tide , Crush of Tentacles and Aether Gale please tell me what you think and if you have more ideas on how to help I would really like it.
6 months ago
Yeah. I guess they are not the usual includes
Blade of the Bloodchief is to get counters on Lazav for when I switch to an infect creature.
Maybe there is more efficient cards to the strategy.
Aether Gale occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%