Ok I would like to get started here. A lot of what I have in mind comes from a very old brainstorm here. I view every creature here as nihilistic. They want to destroy the world. All of their laws and religious are based on harsh and quick justice and nihilism. The reason that I imagined them to be nihilistic, is the long line of prophecies. Prophecies are often misinterpreted and in this case, the people of Chavest have prophecies indicting that if the world is destroyed suffering will end. They interpret that the world will rise again from the destruction and worship a legendary phoenix as part of their religion. In turn they want to bring forth this destruction for it to rise again.

To me this screams, knights, clerics, angels, demons, orcs, judges (new subtype)

The judges would be the law keeper that enforce the law to their death. They are actually a judge, jury, executioner kind of thing. They serve at the pleasure of their dictator, who is the ruler and uniter of nation and of religious belief. Non-believers and law breakers will not stand in the dictator's way of bringing forth the end of days. The demons here are actually repentant demons that wish to bring the end partially for penance and partially to rise again as the prophecy teaches. The angels are fallen angels with similar motivation to the demons.

Burn, Removal, sweepers, Anti land are all abilities I see here. They are all about razing the ground, destroying and burning things to the ground in the name of their mission.

I would be glad to provide more on this if needed, trust me I have a lot more details on this basic concept. As in I have names, places and story already written, if needed. I love this shard. :)

I love the idea of this place. In addition to knights, clerics, angles and demons, I could possibly see rouges and mercenaries(people who do bad things for the demons in exchange for what something the demons promised them) as well as spirits and elementals and zombies/skeletons.

I could see us doing something with laws like what we did with gemstones. Laws could be enchantments that encourage or discourage certain in game behaviors.

I agree that this should have burn, and removal as well as discard (a place like this is bound to take a to have an effect on your insanity) as well as life gain and anti land.

I see vampires in this shard. Possibly as one of the leading races with a tribal theme a la Zendikar block. Maybe there could be a sort of anti-prophecy leader of a rebellion against society. Also, this religion could possibly have some sort of "god" who is based on legends of the other shards before they separated, like Bant legends of Malfegor and Asha. I see Chavest as a self-destructive Bant, like it could have been if demons ran the show instead of angels. Maybe we could have three leaders of Chavest, each aligned with two of the colors, and each made a pact with a demon.

@IronHead - the merc and rouge thing could work I think.

The law thing would work if we name enchantments for laws, but I would really avoid making it a subtype of enchantment. The more that you do things like that, the more issue you have with forcing a build around the subtype. It acts as a tribe to some extent. Look at arcane from Kamigawa. Huge failure. I think that if many of the lws are in flavor tet or names of enchantments that is a great idea, but don't think it should be a subtype.

Also I don't see discard here. Discard seems to be more of an ulgris thing. The environment of Ulgris plays with peoples' minds in its endless dispair, but some minor discard could be here, not sure as a major theme.

Zombies/skeletons I don't see at all. These people want to destroy and kill stuff, not bring it back from the dead. Undead to me fit in W/B/G better because all three colors have history of graveplay.

zombie esc shaningans are for gwb. Also i think that as far as the chav relgion goes. It needs to take examples from the worst moments of religious history. The crusades etc. This plane believes that are correct. And everyone else needs to get in line or perish.

Creatures-demons, angels, humans, clerics, i do like vamps i think...though i dont think they should be a major creature type (like zendikar)

Also just good info The planeswalker for this shard will be the last one we see.

I like the idea of three religious leaders, each aligned with each of hte three color combinations.

Discard was ulgris

But Burn, Board sweep, remove from game effects, a land destruction, destroy target etc. LIfe drain. protection from colors.

Gemstones was enough. If we have to many subtypes the set becomes convoluted.

I like Judges though.

For cleave i think it depends on the toughness. a 3/1 cleave for 3 wouldn't be ridiculous. (great card but etc etc)

also this is the last red shard so just rember that if there are any red esc things missing this is the place to put them. (i think dragons are on irindu so we are safe there)

I want to see hellkites or something. I'm also getting a minor color-reversal theme here: black angels and knights, red/white demons and horrors? I like land destruction and sacrifice effects.

The whole religious theme reminds me of the new Phyrexia. Clerics in all three colors, emphasizing the more "negative" aspects of the colors? For example, tyrannical or fascist white cards.

The storyline makes me want to see the Book of the Prophecy as a rare artifact, something very puritanical and self-destructive. Also, a Planeswalker who is persecuted for his/her/its non-mainstream beliefs, such as optimism?

This shard discussion screams Vampires. They can be self destructive and that fits in with sacrifice and dealing damage to one's own birthplace. However, I would like them to be more brutal vampires, not elegant and graceful(for the most part) like on Zendikar.

Just to clear some stuff up, when I suggested the law thing I wasn't necessarily suggesting a sub type, more of a flavor mechanic with a strong in - game representation on on Chavest.

I love the idea of Hellkites. I think we do have dragons on Inrindu but their more elegant. I would love to see at least one savage Jund type dragon here. Knights should be represented on all colors as they represent everything this shard is about, fanatics who are willing to further their cause by any means necessary.

Taking inspiration from other major moments of fanaticism in history such as the crusades or the Spanish Inquisition is also a really cool idea.

I'm not sure if this would work but I could see some savage people in these lands, likely barbarians who worship false gods such as fallen angles or manipulative demons.

the barbarian thing is interesting. I do not like vampires here though. Vampires do not fit in a religous zealot civilization at all. I really don't see it. To me hellkite=dragon. I think the big bad flyers here are the demons and 1 main legendary phoenix as it represents the dying of the world and being reborn of the fire. more symbolically tied to thier nihilistic purpose

Well, dragons were done on Irindu, but hellkites, though they have subtype dragon, are much more vicious and destructive. I like the comment about being more similar to Jund dragons. (More Hellkite Overlord than Treva, the Renewer .)

The talk about "false gods" etc made me think of Karona, False God . Not mechanics-wise, but subtype Avatar. Maybe a Phoenix Avatar legend, tying in both story ideas?

The color shift idea was a good one for the feel of this place.

Black/Red Clerics Black Angels White Demons Red Vampires (to be extra savage) etc

How about some Kobolds? Torture monks? Carnivorous goats?!? lol

I could also see an underground/isolated society that is in conflict with the main peoples. Sort of an internal jihad within the shard just as they come into conflict with the others.

Goats and Kobolds are fail creatures. The torture monk idea may have merit, though.

Imps should be here too to serve the Demons.

I like the idea of judges being human only, and named legendary cards. Each could have a pet vice that they persecute. Actually, I like the idea of calling them inquisitors rather than judges. I think they should each have one or more tap ability that destroys creatures that do something, e.g., RW, [t] : destroy all equipped creatures.

I can see some card names like Pogrom, Inquisition, Mortification, Jihad, etc. I'm thinking sorceries that may target races/classes or something.

I like the idea of board sweepers here too -- possibly even reprinting wrath or armageddon, etc. Perhaps a red themed board sweeper something like "CARDNAME deals 8 damage to each creature, player, and planeswalker".

If land destruction is part of the shard, possibly have a swords like effect, e.g., "destroy target land, its controller gains 2 life."

I'll chime in with more later - I'm digging the flavor of this shard - but I'd like to chime in with a question and a quick opinion.

First, if I remember correctly, this is the third set story-wise, correct? And all the shards started out merged together in what will be the first set, and end up pulled apart by this one?

If so, what do the inhabitants know or remember about the time when they were as one? That seems like something that could play a significant role in the religion here.

Second, I agree with squire1 - I really don't like the idea of vampires here. I'm not fond of the tribe right now to begin with, I'll freely admit; but I don't think they work here. This has more of a blasted-battlescape feel to it, a constant battleground with a religion trying to eke its way in. Vamps like to have subtlety and established hierarchy, and I don't think this shard will have the environment they want.

Plus, again, I just don't like them. They're overplayed right now. Let's do something a little more interesting.

I think white should have a good amount of vigilance.

Pingers targeting target attacking or blocking creature is a good red/white flavor compromise.

I'd like the community to consider being more creative. Black vs White has been done. Its been reiterated so many times. What if black and white teamed up? We could have a Group vs Unknown story.

Out of chaos came a religion. Demons and Angels both serve the Chav in their own ways. They lead the masses of knights, Clerics, imps, and humans in a quest to build a relic. The relic is a enormous undertaking requiring plenty of minerals. The civilized world allies to mine the earth of precious dark matter. As they work they are barraged by attacks from the earth itself. Earthquakes, Pyroclastic volcanoes, plutonic magma flows, and Nuee ardentes kill workers by the thousands and fill the sky with ash.

Nuee ardentes: dense super-heated gas which can travel at speed of up to 500km an hour. They incinerate everything in their path.

Reprint of Wrath would be good here.

List of creatures:

Demon, Angel, Avatar, Knight, Human, Rebel, Cleric, Rogue, Adviser, Shaman, Horror, Bird

This is set is going to be the next Jund

Ugh. I really hope we avoid that, as well.

Might be hard to. The colour combination just screams "PLAY ME!"

I sense a badass BR demon.

I want a WB legendary creature with deathtouch, lifelink and an abilty that blows something up

The planeswalker here could be of an unconventional race, like orc or a demon, who remembers life before the Book of Chav and wants to return to it. Not necessarily a "good" planeswalker, but not allied with the government either.

Ob Nixilis, the Fallen 's backstory.

I was thinking ahead to this shard before we got this description. I imagined some things, and was curious to if my imaginings might match up with what we would be given, at all.

Not quite, of course. But some things might actually fit, or at least spark some ideas from the community, so I will go ahead and put it down:

So I came up with this: Think of the Mad Max movies. Seriously. I pictured the environment shown in those films. Wide stretches of barren flatlands with some mountains and shallow water holes(swamps) scattered around. I started to think of creature types. One lept out: Humans... Berserker, pirate, rogue, mercenary types. A sort of Gang Land. And perhaps some kind of group of "good" humans who band together in order to survive this. What would all these humans do? fight, steal, sabotage, raid, use crude vehicles and weapons, blown things up. I thought land destruction could be big here. Maybe major. They blow up each others territories. Resources, such as water are low...the cause of many conflicts.

A little long - sorry (2 posts)

This set so far screams a few things to me.

The entire world does have the zealot feel, like you'll have clerics of various origins devoutly following a certain side. (angels/Demons) it has the feel of a barren landscape where war is still fought among the celestial beings.

My 2 ¢

<dt><b>Demons</b> <img src="http://www.gatheringground.com/images/MtgDetails/Symbol_B_Mana.gif"><img src="http://www.gatheringground.com/images/MtgDetails/Symbol_R_Mana.gif"></dt>   <dd>Creatures of malicious origin, Black and Red in nature obliterating the terrain as well as outright destructive power. Make a few with flight but sub-lease the CMC slots below 2 and 3 to their lesser cousins.</dd>

Imps maybe a few

Angels

Avatars

Knights

Clerics

Barbarians

Judges

I'd say run a few named character for this, like "so and so, the Angel of Wrath" and ", The Demon Lord" etc.

Keywords: Cleave, Land walk, Sacrifice, Life loss/gain, Protection, Flight, Vigilance, Haste, ?Double Strike?

Can't wait for the challenges :D

I love a lot of the ideas I see from everyone. There are a couple things to keep in mind though. This is a shard that will interact with other shards. The way I veiwed it was that for the most part, Chavest was solid in thier beliefs and unified in thier beliefs. This creates conflicts when they encounter the other shards. This is because the other shards do not want to be destroyed even though Chavest thinks it is for the best.

I think that if you already have 3 factions in conflict with one another before this happens, it becomes too convoluted later on.

To answer MagnorCriol's question, originally we were going to work backward, but that was changed. This is the first/base set of the block, hence lots of slots per shard.

This implies that so far there has been no exposure to other shards. So Chavest was in chaos (red) in the beginning, but the rule of law (white) was put in place and even repentant demons and other denizens can get on board with the idea of destroying everything (black) to end suffering. There are some that are not on board with this and hence I think a few barbarian/berserker/rouges would make sense as the targets of the justice.

I think that polarizing the colors detracts from the mechanics of the shard and the flavor. One religion based on a nihilistic (black) crusade (white) for the rebirth like the phoenix (red). Unifies this shard and sets it up to hate on the others later.

I am really digging on the cycle of Judges and law themes to enchantments. The judges could even be the enforcers of the laws and have similar names, citing the same laws. Or even have the law in the flavor text for both. This seems lazy but having a law as a reapting mantra on several cards imparts the dedication to it.

@M457ERSP00K - ok I don't see the flight think except really limited to phoenixes, imps and demons

Ah - now that i have a better understanding of the desire.

It makes sense - I can see it working in a twisted kinda way :D. I like this set.

I can see the sacrifice effect working well, coupled with "when _ is sent to the graveyard from the battlefield" effects..

And yes - limit flight to the imps, a few demons and definately the pheonix(es).

I am totally on board with the judges/laws.

The barbarians/beserkers/rogues will balance the already human aspect of Clerics, which I think is important to give the variety. Somehow though, i think Bloodfire Dwarf (or the likes) would make one hell of an enterence, or exit, in this set..lol Maybe dwarves have a place? Passionate about the 'understanding' shared with them about the need for all things to be destroyed in order for a new begining. (land destruction and random bits of damage have been their calling for a long time) need a Stone Rain reprint too.. something like it, with the whole end of days feel.

MAKE THE JUDGES BASED ON EACH OF THE SEVEN DEADLY SINS!!!! sorry i love that theme. We should discuss if we are doing a cycle of judges then do you guys want to have them incorporated into the challenges? For instance instead of just being like make a black and red rare. do y ou want us to be like make three rares one of which must be a judge for each color combination etc etc.

yah right now my general understanding. is that the first set involves just showing what each shard is like. Second they all combine for a very specific reasons that we kind of have and then the third set is the telling of htem being broken apart again.

i think if we just have pheonixs demons and angels, then we have our big flyers. maybe having three mythic or legendary ones, a black white angel, red black demon, and white red pheonix. maybe have one judge serving each god flyer. (this doesnt mean we cant have smaller angels demons and pheonixs etc)

OK, you guys might shoot this right down... but...

SAMURAI AND NINJAS!

This screams like "Human Ninja" and "Orc Samurai." Creatures that can reasonbly be seen as black (shady) and white (loyalty) and red (cleaving their damage and being destructive/disruptive).

Plus, we would have a creative field day with these subtypes...

I think having demons AND angels, knights AND imps in the same shard is kind of weird.

to quote Squire1... 11:39 a.m. on February 23, 2011 "I love a lot of the ideas I see from everyone. There are a couple things to keep in mind though. This is a shard that will interact with other shards. The way I veiwed it was that for the most part, Chavest was solid in thier beliefs and unified in thier beliefs. This creates conflicts when they encounter the other shards. This is because the other shards do not want to be destroyed even though Chavest thinks it is for the best.

I think that if you already have 3 factions in conflict with one another before this happens, it becomes too convoluted later on."

I completely agree. I think we should have creatures that summarize the shard in themselves... not have fighting factions. So I would say go with the Judges type or Samurai/Ninjas.

This is totally personal preference, if the community wants it they get it as it is a community set, but please, please, PLEASE crying. No ninja Samurai action. Kamigawa was the worst and most closed mechanic set that was ever made. all the mechanics were lame and ninja mean adding ninjitsu keyword just as samurai were defined as bushido. I beg no. But we will go along with whatever the community wants of course, as the design team works at the please of the community as a whole.

Samurai are just Japanese knights anyway really. :P

ill post a lil bit right now and i will probably post more later.

for creature types i would love too see devils make an appearance just because they are a subtype not used that often and they can fit in well here. I love the judges idea. we could give red access to shamans instead of clerics if neccessary. for the religous aspect i could see a religous leader who maybe sees al others as not worthy of his/her god so more or less uses the others as a sort of offering for the god (maybe make it a tricolor judge). i believe this shard should be mostly unified with two major opposing factions at least one of which would be the religion spoke of and a possible religion whose god is trying to stop the destruction of the plane at any cost even if it requires the destruction of chavest. lifelink doesnt feel like a keyword that really fits here

also Castigate could be a reprint for this shard. when i mentioned devils I seen them as mostly red i.e. Scourge Devil

I had a feeling it'd get shot down :)

But, I would want to go about it as if Kamigawa was never made. Samurai and Ninjas COULD be awesome... they just weren't.

If not Samurai/Ninjas... I would want to run with differenct Knights. Shadow Knights, Holy Knights, and Fiery Knights.

I mainly want to see the shard as a WHOLE with B/W/R creatures, and not just shards of the shard with black, white, and red creatures.

How about something "Apocalyptic"? We have Apocalypse , Armageddon , and Damnation ...

Apocalytpic knights, apocalyptic clerics, mages, etc.

Also, I like the Cleave mechanic (and yes it should be costly since its pretty cool/powerful). But how about calling it Impale?

love the judge subtype. There should be lots of lifegain options, too, with cleave running around -- maybe white can sac blockers for life, sort of negating cleave, and of course black can sac their own creatures.

I feel like we need to reprint Barren Glory here. Or have some other effects that trigger when you control no creatures. also: ghosts? and elementals. definitely elementals.

berserkers and shamans, too.

and there should probably be some big-daddy dragons lying around. I'd love to see a solid-white dragon, or a white / black dragon.

Looking at the posts right now I see way too much variation in creature types.

Listed so far: Humans, Demons, Angels, Orcs, knights, clerics, judges, rouges, mercenaries, spirits, elementals, vampires, hellkites, horrors, barbarians, phoenixes, monks, Kobolds, Goats, Imps, Avatars, Rebel Advisers, Shamans, Birds, berserkers, pirates, dwarves, samuri, ninjas.

We need to decide in a few of these to actually use. I don't think one person should be able to veto everything that doesn't fit their own sensibilities. I also don't think previous sets should have any influence on our shards. I can understand if we are sick of a creature type and want to be creative. I don't understand the mentality that it was bad before-> we can't do it better.

Everyone has a different idea for the theme of the set. I see theocratic society, post-apocalyptic scrappers, underworld, and brutal warfare just to name a few. We need to get down a common theme first which will better center our ideas of reasonable creature types.

EDIT--- "I also don't think previous sets SHOULDN'T have any influence on our shards."

@zerotimestatechamp- While I agree with nearly everything you said, design and flavor go hand in hand.

What I mean by this is that goblin flavor means something to the design. Goblins are not 5/5 flyers. The opposition to things like samurai, does not have as much to do with me disliking them. It has to do with the fact that WOTC defined what samurai are like. Part of that definition in current day is that they have Bushido, a mechanic not used in this set. It was considered in the original (like a year ago) articles.

At another thing you brought up: "I don't think one person should be able to veto everything that doesn't fit their own sensibilities". I completely agree. The design team does not do this and has not. We do not submit cards in card challenges but we can participate in brainstorms. In the brainstorming sessions, we keep track of comments and desires of the community in a spreadsheet and then use the most popular ideas. our votes in brainstorms are counted as much as other peoples no more and no less.

Aside from that the design team is 5 people. If I say I hate a card or a concept that happens to be a design team call and the others disagree i am vetoed. The design team is involved to have fun and make sure that there is no one person that has control.

As for mechanics, creature types and theme: all of these are on similar spreadsheets. If someone says they agree with something it gets a tally mark. If a person asserts a new concept, it gets its own row, regardless of what the design team may think of it.

Additionally, someone saying they dislike an idea does not subtract a tally mark already gained.

It works out - we cant include everything that is mentioned, but we do take into account other people saying "I like so and so's idea" (ie the idea gets another vote).

after the deadline, we look at what has the most votes or positive mentions and select the cream of the crop as it were for the challenge guidlines.

I will include the tallies with the BrainStorm results (creature types, mechanics, etc.

Just because it would be so opposite-y and against the grain, I would like to see Elves on this shard. Berserker elves would be a bonus.

With the whole society based around churches, nations seriously infighting, and a hierarchy based around species, could we take a few cues from the society on Bant? What I'm reading about this shard seems to say Bant with a whole lot more RAEG.

I think the idea of humans being this realm in this shard could leave for some interesting ideas, like having ambassadors for the demons and angels the humans desperately trying to gain the respect of the ones who could destroy them in a second.

Just an alteration to the keyword "CLEAVE" to make it fairer and not unlike a pre-existing mechanic, "trample", take it or leave it:

Cleave (If this creature would assign enough damage to its blockers to destroy them, you may have it assign the rest of its damage divided as you choose to any number of target creatures.)

I think this would make more sense since I would not block a creature with the original Cleave EVER

Alternatively:

Cleave (Whenever a creature destroyed by this creature is put into a graveyard, its controller loses life equal to its power.)

Either way, it can't be broken that easily and makes people think twice about gang blocking

I agree completely with Jarrod_0067 on the current wording of cleave. i feel it will make many creatures with cleave basically read "CARDNAME is unblockable"

i like jarrod's suggestions for changes, but here is what i could see it being worded as:

Cleave1 (Whenever a creature blocking this creature is put into a graveyard this turn, it's controller loses life equal to it's toughness.)

Cleave2 (whenever a creature dealt damage by this creature, this turn is put into a graveyard. It's controller loses life equal to it's toughness.)

Cleave3 (Whenever a creature dealt combat damage by this creature, this turn is put into a graveyard. it's controller loses life equal to it's toughness.)

personally i think cleave3 is the best way to go about it. I chose to tie the loss of life to the dead creatures toughness i guess because the creatures toughness is what you would generally cut through.

if i worded the reminder text wrong maybe use a card like Soul Collector as a reference point.

Cleave2 is the better option. It gives deathtouch-peckers a chance at making their own subtype

*deck subtype

Here's another, maybe a little wordier option but it keeps the idea of the original Cleave pretty well:

Cleave (Whenever a creature dealt combat damage by this creature is put into a graveyard this turn, its controller loses life equal to the difference between this creature's power and the destroyed creature's toughness)

This may need rewording. Also, it lets you block so the damage is reduced, instead of reading "This creature is unblockable".

@Carn13 - You pretty much reworded trample.

To avoid Cleave becoming to powerful we can limit the damage it deals.

Example: Cleave 3 (whenever this creature deals combat damage to a creature it deals 3 damage to that creatures controller.

This way we can do Cleave 1,2,3,4...

Id like to see creature type "Fallen" (BW)

Also seeing the back story of Ob Nixilis, the Fallen or as my friends call him "obnoxious" would be cool.

alot of great ideas floating around for cleave. Personally, if I had to choose, so far, I would go with Battlecry1986's version. That may just be me, but I think it acurately adresses the issues of pumping or adding double strike to a creature with cleave and it still keeps it different enough from trample. I would even feel more comforatble with his wording, giving EOT cleave effects and aura cleave effects. It is also more conducive to the smaller common creatures having cleave to some extent which is great.

Battlecry1986 has a really good idea and I'm liking it too.

And the color combination of BWR reminds me of Oros, the Avenger and makes me feel like these colors are also made for dragons.

@squire1 , $ªmHεiπ Thanks for the detailed reply. I like the democratic approach you take to moderating these brainstorms.

Creature type Spirit fits white and black

I love the religious part of this shard!

I would love to see the clerics in various colors:

W/B Clerics - Religious sadistic people, who will do anything to uphold their religion and beliefs. They believe in sacrifices for the greater good.

W Clerics - Clerics, who truely belief in a better world, and are responsible for spreading the religious beliefs to the other creatures through their monestaries.

R/x Clerics - New clerics, converted by the W clerics, and have the religious beliefs, but are still having the enormous amount of rage in them from all the destruction in their past.

These are the main categories I would love to see for the cleric subtype!

And regarding to cleave, Battlecry1986's suggestion seems very viable.

I see a lot of bord wiping cards and a bunch of creature hate in this shard

"Battlecry1986 says...

Example: Cleave 3 (whenever this creature deals combat damage to a creature it deals 3 damage to that creatures controller.

This way we can do Cleave 1,2,3,4..."

This i like.

Also remember black and white will be matched together with the last shard GWB, which will have an undeady feel to it. so like spirits, zombies etc would feel more at home there.

@Jarrod_0067: Oops. Nvm.

Yes, Battlecry's version of Cleave is really good. Should it trigger from dealing damage or from being blocked? (my motivation for asking, will Protection stop Cleave?) Also, would damage or direct life loss be more appropriate?

To limit the number of creatures here, perhaps the shard should just be a giant battleground between Angels (WR) and Demons (BR), with humans serving as thralls and zealots. Throw in some giant church structures if you want. Black, white and red as a colour combination is incredibly destructive, and that's likely to happen a lot in our card mechanics. Instants and sorceries which focus on the battle phase, creatures with Cyclops Gladiator style abilities, and yes, LOTS of creature destruction. Some work with enchantments would also be nifty.

CHAVEST HISTORY

After the shards split, Chavest flew off in destruction. Volcanoes, once dormant, started erupting and causing havoc to the small villages. The demons awoke and warred, their battles embodying destruction itself. False prophets start leading local villages to believe in their fantasies, so that they could extract money from the villages. Local knights and angels, being in disbelief from all of this madness, indenture their services to the demons to escape from the chaos. Yet even in a chaotic hellscape, there are some heroes. Angels and knights that weren't corrupted began to do battle with the demons. The clerics attempt to restore order to their villages, sometimes succeeding. Religious beliefs, however, are spreading, lead by a powerful sorcerer named Atrem. Atrem is trying to restore what was Chavest before, but is he committed to the plan? Or is he hiding something sinister? Meanwhile, a lawful and orderly angel named (insert name here) watches the destruction of his plane. Will he ascend the planeswalker spark and change Chavest forever?

SETTING

Chavest is a dark, barren landscape, devoid of grass and nature. Fog is all around the more barren areas, looking to engulf confused travelers. Molten volcanoes can be seen, looking all black, with soot and dust. Local villages are dotted all around Chavest, some in distraught and some orderly. Ruins can be found, representing where demons fought. Lairs are at the very edge of Chavest. They are where the demons lie. At the very tip of Chavest is mysterious snow.

@Prophylaxis I love it. I was thinking of also having chaotic/corrupted clerics, Priests of Norn but in red or black. Also would a cool-sounding portmanteau of either "good," "justice," "light," etc be in Latin or Greek or something?

@Prophylaxis I love it. I was thinking of also having chaotic/corrupted clerics, Priests of Norn but in red or black. Also, what would a cool-sounding portmanteau of either "good," "justice," "light," etc be in Latin or Greek or something?

Ideas for the laws:

Law #1 - Those who do not fulfill their duties to The Cause are to be tortured beyond death. (Creatures that would be put into a graveyard are exiled instead)

Law #2 - Peacekeepers are enemies of The Cause and must be punished. (Creatures that did not attack are tapped at the beginning of the end step)

Law #3 - The weak are to be slaughtered for the better of The Cause. (Each player sacrifices all non-artifact creatures with a power of 0 at end of turn)

People: Chavest is unified (mostly). Also, squire1 correct me if i'm wrong (I probably am) but didn't the Negashards have no contact with eachother ever before?

So I really like what Prophylaxis has but in order to keep the shard united skip his story forward a few more years. Let's say Chavest has united under Atrem after he was able to bring peace (at least on the surface), but an uneasiness still lingers as no one understand why the demons of the land agreed, most feel Atrem must have struck a sinister deal.

Just putting this out there. Like it or hate it.

Setting

Chavest is scrublands that lead to a treacherous volcanic range. The people here are ruled by a harsh tyrannical dictator G'reil Tvoul. He is the child of a demon and an angel. He leads a group of people who worship the prophetic teachings of old Chavest. The teachings state that "our suffering and confusion continues due to infidelity to the laws" and that "our suffering will be ended when the world dies and the phoenix fire extinguishes". The sad, torn and repentant demons and angels that live in this land follow these teachings to a misinterpreted T. Much how many religions may. They all worship the phoenixes that live in the volcano and are careful not to break the laws of their people. Because they take the laws so seriously, a new class, Judge, will be put in place. Judges are like those of judge dread but in the dark ages. they are judge, jury, and executioner. Punishment here is always harsh but just in the eyes of the inhabitants, eye for an eye mentality. Because they misinterpret the prophecies they think that their suffering will end and that they will be reborn like the phoenix, what the prophecy really means is that when the world ends and even the phoenix die forever, then all suffering will end. Because they think that the whole ending is best to end suffering, they seek to destroy Andora and break it apart as well as anything that stands in their way. They have only loyalty to their laws and cause of world destruction. I like mixing the structured hierarchy of W/B church themes plus the demon idea as well. The notion that this plane consists of repentant (or lying) demons that believe they need to bring forth the apocalypse for the greater good and the worshipers (suckers) that uphold these beliefs. This is the tuff-stuff plane. Hard, concise and serious name.

Story of the first set

the shard scavenging and surviving as best they can. All wondering why they are there, plague and destruction all around them. The nation of Erous destroys all that they find, but without a society find nothing to subjugate and because of that find it difficult to have a true hold on the shard. Out of the chaos, come a succession of prophets through the years. The prophets travel around Chavest preaching their visions of a future with no suffering. Atst is the first of the prophets and begins to write his prophecies in what will later be called the Book of Chav. The book is passed down to Sadan, then to Faador who continue the tradition of preaching and writing the prophecies of a better future. The teaching begin to take hold of the people of Chavest. Even demons and Orcs begin to follow the teaching. The teachings of Chav become the way of the land. Cities are built and laws are put in place based on the teachings of Chav. Clerics travel to all expanses of Chavest to set up monistaries, monuments, and temples to the growing religion. Society starts with a tyrant Greil Tvoul. His reign brought forth the introduction of the judges and written laws. The judges are Chavest emissaries that travel throughout the shard policing the behaviors of believer and non-believer alike. If a law is broken according to a judge, then they will take the appropriate actions against the perpetrator. While this happens Griel Tvoul has his scholars work on finding a way to this future time of no suffering. The scholars determine that if the entire plane is destroyed, then it will rise again from the ashes like the phoenix and will end all the suffering of Chavest. This unfortunately is a gross misinterpretation of the book. Regardless, this discovery starts Griel Tvoul to call for a crusade to end existence for a better future. The denizens of Chavest see the logic and follow.

Story - My idea is to add something about an underground society. This place would be home to a lot of creatures on this shard seeing as this place seems to be In chaos. Keeping rules and laws are to protect the people and enforce the beliefs of the book. Ultimately I think their rebirth should backfire on them as a long laid plot of a devious plansewalker looking to destroy the plane, or something cool like that lol.

Keywords - I like the Cleave# idea. Persist would be nice. Discard shouldn't be added.

Creature types - I'd like to say vampire is nice except I was thinking on white vampires? No black ones! I don't like angels. Clerics yes please, in all colors. Thralls? In white and black. Love judges idea maybe they could be like lords type? Like goblin judge? And say it does a opposite effect than lords? Laws idea is great but I don't think it needs to be a subtype. Sages anyone? I can also see desert type like nomads? Magic lamp artifact? Lol. Sultans?

I'd like to think another day and ill post some more ideas.

@ Resurrector_of_the_Soulslayer

"Magic lamp artifact?"

a useable variation on card:Aladdin's Lamp would be cool

I'll write some more. This is a continuation of the settings from yesterday.

VILLAGES OF CHAVEST

Confem

(portmanteau of "molten city", Latin)

Confem is the main village/town in Chavest. It has been alive in Chavest since the day the shards split.

Igore

(portmanteau of "fire edge", Latin)

The other village in Chavest, Igore (I was going to add the "n" but found out it spelled out "Ignore") is less crowded and more recent - when the shards split, Igore's volcano started erupting. Igore lies near a dormant volcano.

RACES AND CLASSES OF CHAVEST

HUMANS (all colors)

Humans aligned with the color of white are usually clerics, prophets, knights, and mercenaries. They believe in the good of people and their main power is religion.

Humans aligned with the color of black are usually clerics, prophets, knights, fallen (Humans indentured to the demons), and rogues. They use false religion and witchcraft to their advantage.

Humans aligned with the color of red are usually knights, mercenaries, and barbarians. (possibly clerics). These humans were scarred to life from Chavest's past and use rage to their advantage.

DEMONS (red, black, splash white)

Demons are usually aligned with the color of black and red. They usually do not have classes. The demons embody destruction itself. Before the Negashards were split, the demons were asleep. When they split, they awoke. Demons are solitary and fight with one another. Demons control fallen and imps.

ANGELS (white, splash black and red)

Angels are usually aligned with the color of white, although corrupted angels are known to branch into the black and red colors. There are three groups of angels. One group is independent and try to restore peace to Chavest. Another group are fallen - indentured to demons. The third group are under Atrem's control and serve to protect him.

IMPS (red and black)

Imps are usually aligned with the colors of black and red. Black imps are under a demon's control and serve as more powerful, bulkier imps that have a sacrifice theme. Red imps are independent and scuttle around Chavest, although some have been adopted as pets (this may be subject to controversy).

SPIRIT (black and white)

Spirits are usually aligned with the colors of white and black. Spirits are what to powerful clerics and prophets as fallen are to demons. Spirits may be ghosts of the pasts, or powerful embodiments of fate. White spirits are noble ghosts of the past, while black spirits are under control of black clerics and false prophets.

Prophylaxis - I like what you have written, a lot of thought put in. A small problem, probably easy to rectify though. The shards were never together at this point. They have no memory of other shards. These are 5 completely separate shards in the beginning of the story.

squire1 , I've been staying out of this one so far. Having a hard time understanding it, actually. For one, I detest religiousity in real life, so that aspect(which is seemingly the biggest aspect) doesn't appeal to me. Clerics don't interest me. One thing that I DO find very interesting in real life is SPIRITUAL WARFARE.

I wonder if there could be an aspect of that here. Ordinarily angels and demons would mean exactly that. But so far, I don't see it. I'm confused about them here, and I'm hoping that you can address this.

My understanding of angels and demons is that they are higher beings from the spirit world. They influence humans by getting into our minds, and, in selective instances, have the ability to physically manifest in our dimensional reality.

The description of the angels and demons in chavest sound like they are NOT of the spirit world. It sounds like they are entirely physically 3 dimensional terrestrial creatures. Please say a little more about "fallen angels" and "repentant demons". Why are demons following the religious teachings of humans? How can humans rule demons? I can't wrap my brain around that.

Also how do orcs fit into the storyline? So far it looks to me like this:

white- angels

black- demons

red- (need something)

r/b/w- humans

...and so we have orcs. Is there more to them, storywise? Nothing has been said. I agree that, for balance, there should be a major red creature type. If there is no strong reason for orcs, specifically, then I would like to propose Viashino.

I brought up Viashino during Sorok, and someone said that a draconian race would fit well in the r/b/w shard. I remember that, and now think that whoever said that may have been right. I think that somehow draconian sounds really right in connection with the evil manipulation of humans.

For the record, I don't see vampires here. One, I don't see room for both demons and vampires. Well actually...I don't suppose anyone is familiar with the term "psychic vampire". They are not blood-suckers, but they are deceptive and selfish, and drain people's life energy. Kind of "soul-suckers". These Judges might fit the bill. But perhaps all of that is a bit much.

Anyway, I look forward to better understanding the demons and angels of Sorok. Then, I think might be able to get into this more heavily.

Also, has anyone thought of a storyline explanation for Cleave?

Prophylaxis- enjoying your story ideas, too. They may trigger something with me.

vic, I like your ideas for the shard. I agree especially on the spiritual warfare aspect and within that lies a possible explanation for Cleave, being some kind of weapon the angels and demons have developed to use against one another. They want as little interference in their war as is possible, save what they invite, so they have ways to punish the silly planeswalkers who get involved in their battles.

I think humans, orcs, viashino and any other races unfortunate enough to live on this wedge should be trying to avoid the conflict between these otherworldly entities. The angels and demons are on a completely different scale of power, when they start fighting mortals are only going to end up as casualties. Their only priority is surviving whatever gigantic clash is happening around them.

Angels and Demons work hand-in-hand. Yin and yang: complete opposites but without eachother they are lost. They may dislike eachother, but they fight for a common cause; to cleanse the world. The Demons of Chavest do not want to cause the destruction of life - they see lesser lifeforms as toys, without which they would bore quickly. The Angels wish to protect the weak, however to do so they look to the ancient teachings for answers.

The Book of Chav, written many millennia ago by the prophet and all-powerful tyrant Atst, offspring of an Angel and a Demon, warned of a day when life would cease to exist.

G'reil Tvoul, descendant of Atst, now leads the Demons and Angels, continuing the teachings of his ancestor. A growing populace of humans also follow the book's teachings, constructing temples and altars and conforming to the religion.

Angels create the laws, which once ammended by the Demons, become enforced upon those who worship them. To ensure the laws are followed, Judges are appointed from the highest humans.

As time goes on, Chavest starts to reject its inhabitants with volcanoes erupting frequently and earthquakes leaving destruction behind. G'reil is convinced these are the first signs of the end of life as described in the Book of Chav. Becoming increasingly worried, G'reil turns to the Book for answers. Misinterpreting the entire passage, he campaigns to destroy the current plane so a new, abundant world will be born from the rubble.

Perhaps the demons and angels can travel between the etheral and physical worlds - sort of like amateur planeswalkers. This will protect them from the destruction as they can slip through the window to the spiritual and avoid harm.

@vic - Very perceptive. I will try to address your questions one by one.

Orcs - Why orcs? No reason whatsoever. It is an underused race that is somewhat chaotic. Viashino would work just fine here. I think they fit fine. I will totally back them.

Fallen angels/demons - well the ethereal nature of angels and demons is very debatable dependent upon religion of course. In this case they would be more of a milton version, wherein they re more akin to physical beings that battle with weapons and kill each other.

The only thing I think that you really missed here was that the angels and demons are not ruled by humans. They are ruled by the same religious beliefs of Chavest, they believe them. And hence they follow their teachings. These beings have been cast out of their homes and sent to Chavest (fallen). Because of this they want salvation. The book of Chavest, seemingly offers this.

Specifically answering why demons would follow this religion. That is a good question. That is a question that everyone should be asking. Sadly the answer comes in the 3rd set.

Story line explanation for cleave - No story line has been created for this yet. When Cleave was originally designed, the idea of Judge subtype, and tyrant subtype were thought of to have this. Primarily the Tyrant subtype. The general, and I mean general discussion was basically around a certain determination behind an attack. Meaning tht they are so determined to hit a player, they will whether you try to stop them or not. Nothing more than that has ever been discussed, to the best of my knowledge. I see it being on knights and judges mostly.

I hope that I addressed everything you asked. This is my perspective on this ONLY. No one else. I think that many have stuck with the religious theme, but many have taken different views on it. I actually like the one that Jarrod_0067

Fallen angels/demons- Ah, so you're saying that ordinarily these would be creatures of the spirit realm(I agree), but that THESE particular ones have, for some reason, been CAST OUT of the spirit world, onto Chav(presumably losing some of their powers), and now have to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, and try to gain a foothold here on this physical plane? Interesting. I would like to know why they lost their place in the spirit realm.

ruled by humans- I said this because they are following the religion from the book of Chav. I had assumed that Atst was human, and all of the teachings and religion came from humans. Is that not the case?

Jarrod_0067 has a very interesting idea(at least I never caught it before), with Atst being offspring of angel and demon. Also G'reil Troul of the same lineage.

Wow! So...how about this? Do we want to say that that's what the whole Judge class is? They are angel/demon hybrid, but let's say with a good deal of human DNA, so as to give the appearance of being basically human? I guess this means that there would have been breeding among fallen angels, cast out demons, and the humans. AND THAT actually goes in line with some real life lore that is around today. Look up the "Nephilim". This is purported to be a race of giants(and not nice ones) that came from angels breeding with earth women. Not certain, but I think perhaps these angels later went on to follow Lucifer, and join the ranks of demons. One site you can go to is www.stevequayle.com and click on "Giants and Ancient History".

Hey, what if our Judges are Nephilim(or the equivilant)? Humanoid, but not humanitarian Giants, whose bloodlines come from fallen angels/demons? Perhaps a little out there, but hell, why not? I think it works.

This probably means no room for traditional angels and demons of the spirit realm, but maybe that's okay. Maybe Chavest is about a different kind of angel/demon...the cast out, earthbound variety. Probably still more powerful than humans, but perhaps they cannot fly.

Hoping that "Sie f ied"'s(the name does come across clearly onscreen) idea for Cleave can somehow fit with that.

And what about those Viashino? Does the prophecy fortell the coming of a race of reptilians? And why? Are they a part of some kind of "shift" that is on the way? Do they somehow make it happen? They are a destructive, and selfish race. Chavest has a nihilistic theme. Something could be done with that.

Ah! Viashino could be the big cog in the wheel of the religion(which needs a name soon). Viashino do NOT follow these teachings. They are not interested in any of it. They hate humans. They have their own agenda, and are strong enough to be an obstacle to the Judges, clerics, etc. Perhaps, in a fight, they could even match up with fallen angels/demons.

@vic- i am on board with most of the. Nephilim thing sounds a bit out there, but whatevs.

Viashino sounds good and that is the basic role that I was thinking for orcs but viashino is great as well here, probably better than orcs.

Judges could be hybrid, thats fine. I saw it more as a class than a creature type, but either is fine.

The ruled by humans thing I am still not in agreement though. The fallen angels and demons are the congregation or follower, not subjugates. For example, just because Buddhism comes from Asia, it does not mean that Asians or a sect of them subjugates the rest of the Buddhists from different reagions nd cultural lineages. It just means they all follow the same teachings

@vic I like your idea of the judges being nephilim, but are you referring to the angel/demon hybrid or to actual nephilim like Dune-Brood Nephilim ? Could we have creatures that have creature type Angel Demon?

@squire1 I prefer viashino to orcs, mostly because I want something reptilian, if we're not going to have hellkites.

What if the Chavest Planeswalker is also a descendent of Atst, but doesn't know it? He disagrees with the religion, and is persecuted for it. Something along those lines triggers his spark.

The religion itself could be called Chavism, its members are Chavists, its leaders are Judges, and the High Priest, so to speak, is the Supreme Judge.

squire1 I think maybe I see the confusion with demons ruled by humans. I didn't mean ruled by ALL humans. I meant religion(as I see it)has a heirarchy of rulership. Ex: pope, cardinal, bishop, preist. So, if someone follows a religion, then they are "beneath" those types of people...which I assumed would be human, on Chavest(but maybe not anymore...more on that later).

I see no difference between followers and subjugates. In religion, those are the same, to me. So I was referring to the idea of demons following ANY humans at all...meaning the religious leaders.

Let me make an attempt at some storyline stuff...

PREHISTORY(before the stuff that you gave us)

The world(Andora, I believe) was whole, and all was balanced. But in the spiritual realm, a war was being fought between angels and demons...a war for human souls. This war, for reasons unknown to all but the greatest of mystics, caused the disruption of Andora, and the breaking apart into 5 shards. The "epicenter" of the destruction was in the shard Chavest. It was so severe that signs of the destruction are still evident today.

The separation of green and blue mana and their landforms caused havoc for many. Water and vegetation became less abundant. Many sentient Andoran races became extinct here. Humans held on to survival, barely. But the reptilian Viashino were very well suited to this barren, rocky environment. Survival of the fittest soon put the Viashino at the top. Humans were the only other sentients around, and Viashino used them as food. But they were intelligent enough not to wipe them out completely. They allowed the humans to remain a renewable resource. In other words: Cattle.

Meanwhile, for reasons unknown to nearly all, the spiritual war took a strange turn, ending up with the casting out of a great many angels and demons. They were to sent to Chavest, the center of terrestrial destruction in their great war. Here, they had less power than before, including loss of flight. Still, they had more power(Cleave, maybe more), size, and strength than the humans.

However, not being naturally suited to terrestrial existence, still relying upon soul-energy as fuel, and seeing a lack of it on Chavest, they began to die off. It became evident that both species would not survive unless something was done.

It was decided that in order to keep their species alive, they must mix their offspring with some kind of native life...and continue their bloodlines that way. Humans were easily the most suitable for this. And so it was.

(to be continued)

PREHISTORY (continued...)

The demons and angels were each in competition to outsurvive the other. At the same time, their numbers both shrinking, they needed to work together in order to take on the Viashino in this environment, and wrest the humans from them.

This was done. More blood and destruction rained down on Chavest in this long and deadly campaign. In the fighting, the humans freed themselves from the Viashino. And partly from the humans' own desire to keep future generations from being preyed upon by Viashino, partly from the fallen angels/demons own agenda of continuing their bloodlines, breeding took place between them. Demon/human and angel/human creatures came to be. They possessed the size and powers of the angles and demons, but with a more human appearance...only larger. Around 8-10 feet tall.

There was one special hybrid individual. In a rare instance of angel/demon breeding, there was a male offspring(insert name), a strange and conflicted male child, who grew to be a powerful warrior, possessing powers from both species. He later took a human female with which to mate. The product of this union was a child named Atst(male or female?). Atst was exceptional, emanating both love and fear, possessing beauty and raw power, yet part human...enough to fit in and capture the allegiance of the mono-humans. And to penetrate into their thoughts. Atst wrote the book of Chav, and began a line of angel/demon/humans, who continued to spread the prophecies.

....And we're back to where you started us.

So I took a little liberty with Atst. I thought s/he should be part human. Just weird to have a totally non-human prophet. So there could be demon/humans and angel/humans around...but angel/demon/human very rare and formidable. I am using the Nephilim story as an inspiration to make these hybrids larger than humans...extra formidable and fearsome. And I'm thinking the powerful Cleave ability would be tied in with this.

It's like "when angels and demons strike, their strike goes beyond the flesh. It hits anything consciously connected to that being...all the way up to the very lifeforce of the planeswalker himself." Awkward, but workable for now, maybe.

Anyhow, I'm thinking that it is only these hybrids who come to the powerful position of Judge. This bloodline stuff is serious business. They won't allow mono-humans to do it. I, too, am thinking of judge as a class. And I like the idea that they are these really big dudes. 8-10 feet tall. Humanoid, but not humanitarian. Races would be demon/human, angel/human, and(maybe)all 3. This gives us three mana colors to use, assuming humans can provide the red. Clerics are mono-humans. They both fear and love the Judges, and do their bidding.

The shard unification comes in with both demons and angels having reasons why they want to see the world destroyed(that part, I think you mainly have covered). Or does that somehow help them get "back home"?

Not sure where this leaves the Viashino, as far as unification. They are enemies of the others, but yet they are naturally destructive, so maybe that common link is enough.

And I'm not quite sure how land destruction fits the story. I guess everyone is trying to destroy the world, and that means destroying land. But I don't know HOW they destroy it. I mean, it's not like they use dynamite. What's the story there?

dude1818- I was not referring to Dune-Brood Nephilim . I was referring to actual Nephilim. And yes, I think we could have an Angel Demon creature. Look at Malfegor . But I think mainly it's humans mixed with one or the other.

...and I like the way you're thinking about the planeswalker.

@vic

Just a few problems with your story.

None of the shards were ever connected. Also, didn't we say that all the shards were created by some type of plainswalker

@Battlecry1986 yes and yes

I'm not familiar with those background points. Where can I find them?

I like the idea of the planeswalker having ties to Atst and disagreeing with the religion because in this plane that gets you killed. So that sets us up with all sorts of goodies like the spark igniting and the planeswalker depending on colors moving against the established system. They could have an underground movement or simply go it alone. Or better yet an underground society. I like the idea of the Nephilim because if Atst is that makes the planeswalker although distantly part Nephilim which could give access to all sorts of fun stuff. Am i vague enough? :P P.S For those of you who don't read Theology randomly Nephilim is roughly a hybrid offspring of an angel and a women If you must know. http://www.nwcreation.net/nephilim.html

Balthasar, your idea of an underground society of Nephilim is brilliant. It suggests that there is a fair bit of congress between the angels (maybe demons too) and the humans, which sets up juicy conflicts within the plane. They would fit either WB or WBR perfectly.

I like the underground idea too, but we would have to be careful about not losing shard unification.

Everyones Ideas are great. Also, Id like to point out

I think the creative team is striving to pit each shard against one another rather than try and tell 5 different stories.

It is for this reason I think we should try and keep the shards as unified as possible. That is not to say each shard shouldnt have its own depth.

Here is my shot at Chavests history.

Recently achieving peace, Chavest has the longest conceivable history of war and Destruction. The greatest known battles have left still unhealed scars across its landscape from Aether rifts to deep cracks in the earth that expand to unknown depths, but the most notable damage was to the hearts of Chavests inhabitance. Spurred by an overwhelming desire for peace; the Heroes of have taken it upon themselves to enforce unspeakably harsh and twisted laws (insert judge class here).

I see Chavest as having only small amount of cities whose walls proved strong enough to withstand constant berating but still burning from recent struggles. In was within these cities that The Book of Chav was pieced together from lost causes and faiths then twisted by the wrecked notions of impure profits.

Chavest should have no one ruler who presides over all but a tremendously complex governmental system as the result of so much war. I see at minimum three beings sharing/struggling with one-another for total control (the embodiment of the three colors none of witch untainted by the others).

Arenas provide Chavests inhabitants with entertainment as well as there election system. Winners in Cavests Arena are appointed to Judge class. It is these Judges that inforce the Law of Chavest. The most proven of the Judges under each respective ruler have shown tendencies to overthrow there own government should they are allowed to become too powerful. It is for this reason I see each Judge carrying an immensely powerful item that in some way keeps them under control.

I see the landscape of Chavest as barren with wide expanses of sand that would be seemingly endless if it hadnt been speckled with forsaken/fallen cities and outposts and remnants of past war-ing nations. Within these ruins I see a race of Viashino whose intelligence seams to be on par with the Goblins of #####. These Viashino loot the forsaken carcass of abandoned Chavest cities slowly piecing back together some of the better preserved ruins.

Id like to see some type of imperial city (attributing to white) I see the city walls higher than the tallest buildings as wide as a highway with scattered patches that have incorporated the fodder that once berated them into part of the wall structure. I dont construction on this wall ever ending. It is in this city I envision the highest level of Arena. The majority of the citizens here should be humans and/or Nephilim but minorities include both angles and demons.

Id like not to dig into the source of Chavests ascendant/descendant races (angles/demons etc.) Just that they are most often found among the wasted landscape or within the deep crevasse that now litter it.

Design mechanics should push for land and creature destruction with a lot of ways to get around things like shroud, regenerate or indestructible. In short I see this as the landscape were they have discovered a way to destroy all forms of life.

I wrote a lot but I tried to keep the story line open for the most part enjoy!

Sry guys I had more than a few typos in my post #93

I think its enough for you to get my consept and BWT #### = Sorok

Judges. I think there should only be three of them, and they should be the main characters of the cahvest story line (excludng the eventual planeswalker)(which could vary well be one of these guys transcended.) I think they should all be gold, one black red, one white black, and one white red.

The three judges of Chavism, All decended from Either angels, demons, or both. They rule over chavest Either with wisdom or fear.

Caval, the judge aligned with red and white mana, is a fierce and proud warrior, quick to make decisions But a extreme believer of the religion he reigns over. (full human, pheonix infused powers)

Ganes, the judge alligned with Black and red mana, Is tyranical. Wanting to destory all that disagrees with The religion of chav. (the most villainous) (human demon)

Tile-The judge alligned with white and black. Is the most unmoving, belives all should stay as is. Most resistant to change. (part angel part human.)

The god King Atst. Part angel part demon, part human pheonix infused. The ruler of all and the one all answer to. His word is law.

Xander Would you care to go more into "phoenix infused"? Sounds intruiging, but I don't quite get the picture of what you're talking about.

...as is how does it work, where did a human get powers from a phoenix, etc?

some thoughts:

1) I think that my Prehistory thing a few posts ago could still apply. Just need to take out the first paragraph, since the shards were never together. Just start it from paragraph 2...and perhaps the Viashino got enslaved by the Nephalim. Maybe they fight Nephalim knights in Battlecry1986's arenas. Perhaps Balthasar's underground revolt is connected to a Viashino uprising

2) about that...I have some more ideas coming, but I would REALLY like to know more pertinent info(such as the shards not being together), before I take the time to write something, and have it turn out that it conflicts with established points.

squire1 , can you think of anything else we should know? How about the planeswalker that created the shards? Any basic story info on him/her? Or has that not been done yet?

Why are fallen angels and demons here, and how did they get here? How and why did they "fall"?

What do we need to know about this Phoenix? It could effect card/storyline ideas. In particular, Xander's phoenix references in #96.

I could come up with ideas about lots of things, but I don't want to do that with a topic, if it's already been done.

3)Xander may be right about having only 3 legendary judges. I was wondering about having all judges be legendary, too. But I don't know... It sounds like we may get down to just having a small enough pool of different creature types, that we could do more rare judges: say 1 of each single color, 1 of each 2-color, and maybe one 3-color. If demons and angels on Chavest are part human(thus no mono demons/angels taking up rare slots), then I think there is definitely room for that.

Because when you really think about it, what other rare creatures would there be?

We're looking at viashino, knight, cleric? How many rares would we get from those tribes? I think that as far as CREATURES go...I really see the rare slots being heavily dominated by the Nephalim(hybrid)Judges.

By the way, as far as I know, something we have not yet done anywhere, is to introduce a new creature type in this set. I see no reason why we couldn't...and no reason why we could use Nephilim(or a similar sounding word, like Nephalus).

NEPHALIM: any hybrid of human + angel/demon, or both. Appear mainly human. But larger. 7-8, maybe 8-10 feet tall. Powerful auras(as in energy fields; the real-life term, not creature enchantments). Angel-human looks a little different from demon-human. Tend to have Cleave...the ability to cut right thru to the soul.

Here's what I'm seeing at the moment:

JUDGES: Rare. Possibly some uncommon. Mainly legendary. Any combo of R/B/W.

Race: Nephilim...human/angel, human/demon, possibly one descendant of Atst who is human/angel/demon. 8-10 feet tall.

(but we could probably use something phoenix-related, to balance the colors)

Have strong activated abilities. Have Cleave.

More straight-forward fighter-types than judges. Less demon/angel, so less "powers". The "enforcers" of the laws.

Also Nephalim. But more human. 7-8 feet tall. Heavy use of Cleave. Moderate other abilities.

It looked like clerics and Viashino were not enough to fill out commons. I thought we had room for a few assassins. Underutilized tribe. It came to me. That's all I got on them.

I just noticed people agreed against multiple factions and didn't say anything about my idea but Battlecry1986 I understand what your saying about the creative team, however with a limited number (let's say my idea is accepted and its 2) of opposing ideas and factions when when this shard comes in contact with another the factions will either unite or fight on three fronts or one will unite with another shard its hard to say really because one would want to kill everything and we really haven't established what the other would want.

I like the Idea of three legendary judges because it stresses Their importance in the society. To go along with squire1 's post" am really digging on the cycle of Judges and law themes to enchantments. The judges could even be the enforcers of the laws and have similar names, citing the same laws. Or even have the law in the flavor text for both."

I'm Liking Having The judge's name we'll use Xander's then Decree. Example Gane's Decree and then having some kind of effect. We agreed also that they would be Enchantments yes?

Sorry for the long post guys.

BTW What did you guys think of the planes walker possibly being a Nephilim?

1) the pheonix infused idea. Somewhere previously the pheonix's being a part of hte religion was brought up and i really liked the idea. Partly because it gives red there angel/demon creature. And two cause i like pheonixs. 2)The idea of pheonix infused i feel would happen using a ritual during hte pregnancy of a nephillim and would have an extreme mortality rate. But when successful creates an extremely powerful creature.

I just want to remind everyone that this of all the shards is the most united with its races. Which is why once the shards combine this shard begins to attack all surrounding shards.

Lastly the creator of the shard will be discussed for the next set. (mind you there are hints already in the cards that have been created)

Those last two snipets...how did you know that? Where can I find that kind of info about the set? It would be very helpful to have that during brainstorming.

Most united in its races what do you mean most similar races? Or most united in their ideals? And If I could get my hands on that info as well that would be nice. Also This is the second time vic has asked for the info and no ones helped fill in the blank.

Xander574-

just want to remind everyone that this of all the shards is the most united with its races. Which is why once the shards combine this shard begins to attack all surrounding shards.

Lastly the creator of the shard will be discussed for the next set. (mind you there are hints already in the cards that have been created)

vic-

Those last two snipets...how did you know that? Where can I find that kind of info about the set? It would be very helpful to have that during brainstorming.

We go all of that stuff from the leftover structure that was written during the time that the creative and design team were separated. This was about a year ago. Some of the articles and threads do not exist anymore. The thing is that all of that stuff can be rewritten anyway. Some points that should be kept in mind that people should know.

1. This is the first set in the block.
2. The shards were created (by some unknown force, most likely planeswalker)
3. The shards are solitary currently (have never experienced one another.
4. When they come together the shards will clash and Chavest will be a driving force there.

These are all basic and broad concepts that can be combined with all the stuff people have written so far. The reason that this stuff does not change is that it was decided by the community and kind of drives the whole set. Changing those things now would be like starting over, so they will not be changed.

As for other questions that were unanswered, well its a long thread that needs to be read.

Xander574 - said something about a phoenix and people act like the idea came from out of the air. It was in the first post in concept

They interpret that the world will rise again from the destruction and worship a legendary phoenix as part of their religion.

Results from the brainstorm and the next challenge is up. check it out here